1 00:00:07,909 --> 00:00:05,300 welcome to tales from the rabbit hole 2 00:00:11,540 --> 00:00:07,919 I'm your host Nick West my guest today 3 00:00:14,539 --> 00:00:11,550 is Ian who goes by the name theory QED 4 00:00:17,960 --> 00:00:14,549 on meta bunk and on YouTube 5 00:00:22,400 --> 00:00:17,970 Ian is very interested in the UFO 6 00:00:24,230 --> 00:00:22,410 phenomenon and we've discussed it on on 7 00:00:26,420 --> 00:00:24,240 meta bunk in the variety of threads I 8 00:00:28,519 --> 00:00:26,430 think Ian would say that he and I have 9 00:00:32,030 --> 00:00:28,529 somewhat differing opinions about what 10 00:00:34,100 --> 00:00:32,040 ufos likely are and about a variety of 11 00:00:36,500 --> 00:00:34,110 the different incidents so we're going 12 00:00:39,020 --> 00:00:36,510 to discuss our differences and things 13 00:00:40,940 --> 00:00:39,030 that we agree on so Ian welcome welcome 14 00:00:42,560 --> 00:00:40,950 to tales from the rabbit hole yes thanks 15 00:00:45,590 --> 00:00:42,570 for having me well thank you very much 16 00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:45,600 for being here all right so uh it's 17 00:00:50,660 --> 00:00:47,010 gonna get into it like how would you 18 00:00:52,850 --> 00:00:50,670 define a UFO that's a great question so 19 00:00:55,310 --> 00:00:52,860 I saw recently you posted on Twitter a 20 00:00:57,799 --> 00:00:55,320 real UFO that you had taken which is 21 00:01:00,139 --> 00:00:57,809 just a blurry far away picture huh and 22 00:01:03,529 --> 00:01:00,149 that's a good point that anything 23 00:01:05,780 --> 00:01:03,539 unidentified is a real UFO but in my 24 00:01:08,870 --> 00:01:05,790 opinion when people that are interested 25 00:01:12,140 --> 00:01:08,880 in UFOs say the word real UFO or genuine 26 00:01:14,300 --> 00:01:12,150 real genuine UFO what we usually mean is 27 00:01:17,090 --> 00:01:14,310 something that has been verified so it's 28 00:01:19,370 --> 00:01:17,100 not just one person with a with a blurry 29 00:01:20,899 --> 00:01:19,380 camera image that we can't verify but 30 00:01:23,300 --> 00:01:20,909 instead it would be something with 31 00:01:24,770 --> 00:01:23,310 outstanding evidence like what we have 32 00:01:27,950 --> 00:01:24,780 with the Navy where we have radar 33 00:01:31,340 --> 00:01:27,960 corroboration multiple witnesses and it 34 00:01:35,240 --> 00:01:31,350 can be verified with tangible data now 35 00:01:35,899 --> 00:01:35,250 do you remember the the Chilean UFO from 36 00:01:38,420 --> 00:01:35,909 her I do 37 00:01:42,550 --> 00:01:38,430 years ago that was that was described as 38 00:01:45,560 --> 00:01:42,560 a verified UFO but turned out it wasn't 39 00:01:48,499 --> 00:01:45,570 will you say it was a verified UFO at 40 00:01:52,100 --> 00:01:48,509 the time or it was a mistakenly verified 41 00:01:54,410 --> 00:01:52,110 UFO that's a great point too because it 42 00:01:56,330 --> 00:01:54,420 is somewhat subjective depending on what 43 00:01:58,340 --> 00:01:56,340 your opinion is obviously you think that 44 00:01:59,959 --> 00:01:58,350 it's not a UFO but the Chilean 45 00:02:02,389 --> 00:01:59,969 government does think that it's UFO 46 00:02:04,160 --> 00:02:02,399 correct I don't think that showing 47 00:02:05,450 --> 00:02:04,170 government as such does no I'm pretty 48 00:02:07,370 --> 00:02:05,460 sure actually they would accept the 49 00:02:09,529 --> 00:02:07,380 explanation now seeing as it is it was a 50 00:02:12,190 --> 00:02:09,539 perfect match for this particular radar 51 00:02:13,880 --> 00:02:12,200 track he was in the exact point in space 52 00:02:15,620 --> 00:02:13,890 okay 53 00:02:18,170 --> 00:02:15,630 just for people who aren't familiar with 54 00:02:21,380 --> 00:02:18,180 this this was a kind of a distant 55 00:02:23,390 --> 00:02:21,390 looking UFO that was taken by a Chilean 56 00:02:24,680 --> 00:02:23,400 Navy helicopter using their infrared 57 00:02:27,200 --> 00:02:24,690 thing they were looking for like 58 00:02:30,440 --> 00:02:27,210 smugglers and whatnot and they saw this 59 00:02:32,030 --> 00:02:30,450 thing and it they couldn't figure out 60 00:02:34,730 --> 00:02:32,040 what it was it wasn't on the radar it 61 00:02:37,850 --> 00:02:34,740 wasn't responding to radio and so they 62 00:02:42,199 --> 00:02:37,860 they gave it to this Chilean Air Force 63 00:02:45,110 --> 00:02:42,209 body that was set up to investigate UFOs 64 00:02:46,580 --> 00:02:45,120 or enormous aerial phenomena and they 65 00:02:48,199 --> 00:02:46,590 couldn't figure out what it was after a 66 00:02:49,640 --> 00:02:48,209 couple of years even though this he had 67 00:02:51,110 --> 00:02:49,650 a few theories but it might be a flame 68 00:02:53,120 --> 00:02:51,120 and said no it can't be a plane because 69 00:02:55,490 --> 00:02:53,130 of this and that and then they 70 00:02:57,050 --> 00:02:55,500 eventually released it and then people 71 00:02:59,380 --> 00:02:57,060 on the internet like pointed out that 72 00:03:02,780 --> 00:02:59,390 there was a plane in that exact spot 73 00:03:04,699 --> 00:03:02,790 visually that was departing the airport 74 00:03:06,820 --> 00:03:04,709 at that time and if you do a 3d 75 00:03:09,290 --> 00:03:06,830 recreation it matches perfectly 76 00:03:11,300 --> 00:03:09,300 that's a great explanation but I think 77 00:03:13,910 --> 00:03:11,310 it still doesn't completely explain why 78 00:03:16,010 --> 00:03:13,920 it wouldn't respond to radar calls and I 79 00:03:18,470 --> 00:03:16,020 agree with you that your explanation is 80 00:03:20,630 --> 00:03:18,480 definitely plausible if not even likely 81 00:03:23,750 --> 00:03:20,640 I I like your explanation for that case 82 00:03:26,539 --> 00:03:23,760 and but I do think that it's still being 83 00:03:28,340 --> 00:03:26,549 portrayed as a real UFO because it was 84 00:03:32,090 --> 00:03:28,350 on contact recently where they said that 85 00:03:33,500 --> 00:03:32,100 the temperature was 700 degrees and and 86 00:03:35,690 --> 00:03:33,510 you had a great point that you can't 87 00:03:37,729 --> 00:03:35,700 know that temperature just by looking at 88 00:03:40,310 --> 00:03:37,739 the footage it's only relativistic you 89 00:03:42,350 --> 00:03:40,320 can't determine an exact temperature but 90 00:03:45,770 --> 00:03:42,360 that brings us to the five observables 91 00:03:47,870 --> 00:03:45,780 so if that video had shown one of the 92 00:03:50,000 --> 00:03:47,880 five observables or more than one of the 93 00:03:51,560 --> 00:03:50,010 five observables where it's doing 94 00:03:54,380 --> 00:03:51,570 hypersonic speeds or something like that 95 00:03:55,850 --> 00:03:54,390 then we can rule out the passenger plane 96 00:03:58,460 --> 00:03:55,860 explanation and then it would be even 97 00:04:00,020 --> 00:03:58,470 more of the genuine UFO so the five 98 00:04:02,270 --> 00:04:00,030 observables this is something someone 99 00:04:05,330 --> 00:04:02,280 has suggested that like was it one of 100 00:04:07,490 --> 00:04:05,340 them needs to be there to be a UFO I 101 00:04:09,259 --> 00:04:07,500 think this comes from a tip and yes I 102 00:04:11,840 --> 00:04:09,269 think it is at least one and we have 103 00:04:14,090 --> 00:04:11,850 anti-gravity lift which is a bit 104 00:04:16,159 --> 00:04:14,100 subjective because it could be a lighter 105 00:04:18,500 --> 00:04:16,169 than aircraft obviously it could be some 106 00:04:20,900 --> 00:04:18,510 kind of blimp sudden and instantaneous 107 00:04:23,390 --> 00:04:20,910 acceleration hypersonic velocities 108 00:04:26,270 --> 00:04:23,400 without signatures so no visible exhaust 109 00:04:27,379 --> 00:04:26,280 plumes low observability or cloaking 110 00:04:30,140 --> 00:04:27,389 both visually 111 00:04:32,480 --> 00:04:30,150 or on radar and also trans medium travel 112 00:04:34,159 --> 00:04:32,490 so going into water coming out of water 113 00:04:35,480 --> 00:04:34,169 going into space flying through the air 114 00:04:37,879 --> 00:04:35,490 that sort of thing 115 00:04:40,339 --> 00:04:37,889 yeah and I guess like the Chilean one 116 00:04:40,820 --> 00:04:40,349 wouldn't really yeah so I agree with you 117 00:04:43,939 --> 00:04:40,830 there 118 00:04:46,129 --> 00:04:43,949 but it's not such a strong case because 119 00:04:47,839 --> 00:04:46,139 your explanation makes sense yeah and 120 00:04:50,209 --> 00:04:47,849 also you asked you said why didn't they 121 00:04:52,760 --> 00:04:50,219 show up on radar and the reason was that 122 00:04:53,989 --> 00:04:52,770 they were looking like 50 miles ahead of 123 00:04:56,089 --> 00:04:53,999 them when it should have been looking a 124 00:04:57,110 --> 00:04:56,099 hundred miles ahead of them they did and 125 00:04:59,179 --> 00:04:57,120 that's understandable 126 00:05:01,580 --> 00:04:59,189 yeah didn't they try to contact it with 127 00:05:03,800 --> 00:05:01,590 the radio control tower yeah they say no 128 00:05:06,529 --> 00:05:03,810 they didn't they they just held it on 129 00:05:08,179 --> 00:05:06,539 the hailing frequency which is like you 130 00:05:09,980 --> 00:05:08,189 know when you're in the plane people 131 00:05:11,869 --> 00:05:09,990 think that you can just like radio a 132 00:05:13,369 --> 00:05:11,879 plane like a jet flies up in the radio 133 00:05:14,899 --> 00:05:13,379 as a plane but it has to be on the 134 00:05:16,790 --> 00:05:14,909 correct frequency so you need to know 135 00:05:19,969 --> 00:05:16,800 what frequency they are listening to and 136 00:05:22,879 --> 00:05:19,979 when a plane is departing an airport it 137 00:05:25,159 --> 00:05:22,889 will be on either the tower frequency as 138 00:05:27,140 --> 00:05:25,169 it's taking off Oriol beyond the 139 00:05:29,089 --> 00:05:27,150 departure frequency which is the the 140 00:05:31,010 --> 00:05:29,099 people who organize the planes leaving 141 00:05:33,200 --> 00:05:31,020 the area and it's the separate 142 00:05:35,029 --> 00:05:33,210 frequencies for arrivals and there's 143 00:05:38,390 --> 00:05:35,039 another one for the ground and when 144 00:05:39,860 --> 00:05:38,400 planes just flying around it's on it's 145 00:05:42,529 --> 00:05:39,870 the the common frequency which i think 146 00:05:43,790 --> 00:05:42,539 is 120 one point zero as I remember it's 147 00:05:46,309 --> 00:05:43,800 been a while since I actually flew a 148 00:05:47,689 --> 00:05:46,319 plane but they would have hailed it on 149 00:05:49,429 --> 00:05:47,699 that frequency they would have assumed 150 00:05:50,629 --> 00:05:49,439 that it's just a plane flying around so 151 00:05:54,559 --> 00:05:50,639 they would have they would have held it 152 00:05:56,629 --> 00:05:54,569 on on one 21.0 they would have assumed 153 00:05:58,639 --> 00:05:56,639 it wasn't a plane departing the airport 154 00:05:59,779 --> 00:05:58,649 if it only was a plane departing the 155 00:06:01,519 --> 00:05:59,789 airport they would have been looking in 156 00:06:02,929 --> 00:06:01,529 a completely different place so they 157 00:06:06,260 --> 00:06:02,939 wouldn't know to go to the departure 158 00:06:08,959 --> 00:06:06,270 frequency for for that plane so that's 159 00:06:11,179 --> 00:06:08,969 why I didn't respond radio calls because 160 00:06:13,519 --> 00:06:11,189 they were just using the the one to one 161 00:06:15,649 --> 00:06:13,529 thing and not the departure thing and 162 00:06:17,089 --> 00:06:15,659 the same thing with radar they would 163 00:06:18,709 --> 00:06:17,099 have looked on their radar which was 164 00:06:21,980 --> 00:06:18,719 shared them things that were nearby them 165 00:06:23,600 --> 00:06:21,990 like within whatever 4050 miles when the 166 00:06:24,889 --> 00:06:23,610 airport was actually I think 80 miles to 167 00:06:26,629 --> 00:06:24,899 the north of them and the plane was 168 00:06:29,450 --> 00:06:26,639 already turning and going north of the 169 00:06:31,850 --> 00:06:29,460 airport at that point so yeah you know 170 00:06:33,709 --> 00:06:31,860 you know I've heard you know objections 171 00:06:37,040 --> 00:06:33,719 like that before and they've all been 172 00:06:38,089 --> 00:06:37,050 explained and as far as I can tell it's 173 00:06:40,860 --> 00:06:38,099 like a hundred percent on that 174 00:06:43,140 --> 00:06:40,870 particular case I don't really think 175 00:06:45,960 --> 00:06:43,150 so if you actually check all the boxes 176 00:06:47,460 --> 00:06:45,970 that you can actually really argue that 177 00:06:49,200 --> 00:06:47,470 now this isn't something we could say 178 00:06:52,110 --> 00:06:49,210 for the the other cases which were going 179 00:06:53,280 --> 00:06:52,120 to discuss in right but you know what 180 00:06:55,920 --> 00:06:53,290 kind of getting ahead of ourselves here 181 00:06:59,760 --> 00:06:55,930 like yeah so you we were talking about 182 00:07:01,260 --> 00:06:59,770 what is a UFO and you know you you you 183 00:07:04,080 --> 00:07:01,270 saying like it has to be kind of 184 00:07:06,090 --> 00:07:04,090 verified but we when you say verified 185 00:07:07,670 --> 00:07:06,100 does that mean more than one person has 186 00:07:11,129 --> 00:07:07,680 to see it 187 00:07:13,250 --> 00:07:11,139 yes personally I think it should be more 188 00:07:16,159 --> 00:07:13,260 than one person that has seen it and 189 00:07:18,540 --> 00:07:16,169 ideally you would also have some sort of 190 00:07:20,820 --> 00:07:18,550 testable evidence that you have along 191 00:07:24,680 --> 00:07:20,830 with that witness so you would have 192 00:07:26,969 --> 00:07:24,690 either video or radar or some sort of 193 00:07:28,800 --> 00:07:26,979 electromagnetic disturbance or something 194 00:07:30,840 --> 00:07:28,810 that you can test to say that something 195 00:07:31,830 --> 00:07:30,850 physical was there that's that's just my 196 00:07:35,159 --> 00:07:31,840 personal opinion 197 00:07:36,810 --> 00:07:35,169 yeah I know people you know say we 198 00:07:39,540 --> 00:07:36,820 shouldn't discount eyewitness testimony 199 00:07:41,939 --> 00:07:39,550 but it's obviously vastly better if you 200 00:07:43,800 --> 00:07:41,949 can corroborate eyewitnesses with video 201 00:07:45,330 --> 00:07:43,810 and put them side by side and said the 202 00:07:46,740 --> 00:07:45,340 guy says I saw this and you show a video 203 00:07:48,659 --> 00:07:46,750 that shows the same thing that would be 204 00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:48,669 great 205 00:07:56,760 --> 00:07:52,210 have you you ever seen a UFO I actually 206 00:07:59,670 --> 00:07:56,770 did very recently i s it 8 to call it a 207 00:08:02,129 --> 00:07:59,680 UFO because I have only my witness 208 00:08:05,909 --> 00:08:02,139 account and then I have a decent picture 209 00:08:07,260 --> 00:08:05,919 and a terrible video of this UFO and the 210 00:08:09,870 --> 00:08:07,270 best way I can describe it would be a 211 00:08:11,790 --> 00:08:09,880 Chinese lantern it was a orange ball of 212 00:08:13,830 --> 00:08:11,800 light and it's it's going up into the 213 00:08:15,659 --> 00:08:13,840 sky I don't think that they would have 214 00:08:18,270 --> 00:08:15,669 released a Chinese lantern where I live 215 00:08:20,969 --> 00:08:18,280 in Boulder Colorado but if that's what 216 00:08:23,580 --> 00:08:20,979 it was it was moving quite quickly it 217 00:08:24,390 --> 00:08:23,590 was very large very bright and it 218 00:08:26,670 --> 00:08:24,400 disappeared 219 00:08:28,710 --> 00:08:26,680 pretty pretty fast in an upward 220 00:08:30,480 --> 00:08:28,720 direction so I've already got plans to 221 00:08:32,940 --> 00:08:30,490 go to a lantern festival and see if 222 00:08:34,469 --> 00:08:32,950 that's what I said yeah that's it's good 223 00:08:36,930 --> 00:08:34,479 to try to replicate these things like 224 00:08:38,940 --> 00:08:36,940 because you know it was it at night a 225 00:08:41,000 --> 00:08:38,950 fairly dark yeah it was yes 226 00:08:44,970 --> 00:08:41,010 it's very hard to see where things are 227 00:08:46,880 --> 00:08:44,980 no yeah it's used very close yeah you 228 00:08:49,380 --> 00:08:46,890 see sometimes people will look at 229 00:08:51,840 --> 00:08:49,390 landing lights of planes which are quite 230 00:08:53,000 --> 00:08:51,850 a distance away like say like about 40 231 00:08:54,379 --> 00:08:53,010 miles away 232 00:08:55,550 --> 00:08:54,389 and because the lights are pointing 233 00:08:57,290 --> 00:08:55,560 straight at them the planes coming 234 00:09:01,129 --> 00:08:57,300 strict towards them it looks like it's a 235 00:09:02,449 --> 00:09:01,139 light that's rising up in the sky when 236 00:09:03,829 --> 00:09:02,459 actually it's kind of coming towards 237 00:09:07,519 --> 00:09:03,839 that I'm just very very slowly and just 238 00:09:09,920 --> 00:09:07,529 going overhead and so it's it's yes it's 239 00:09:12,769 --> 00:09:09,930 very very difficult to corroborate these 240 00:09:16,519 --> 00:09:12,779 things so you've had a UFO sighting I I 241 00:09:20,000 --> 00:09:16,529 I you know I guess I always say I see 242 00:09:21,860 --> 00:09:20,010 UFOs every day because I go I live under 243 00:09:24,889 --> 00:09:21,870 the flight path for departures from both 244 00:09:27,259 --> 00:09:24,899 Sacramento and San Francisco so I see 245 00:09:29,060 --> 00:09:27,269 the the higher planes from San Francisco 246 00:09:30,829 --> 00:09:29,070 and the lower planes from from 247 00:09:32,180 --> 00:09:30,839 Sacramento and they quite often do that 248 00:09:34,879 --> 00:09:32,190 thing where they come straight towards 249 00:09:35,449 --> 00:09:34,889 me and for a while they looked like like 250 00:09:38,300 --> 00:09:35,459 UFOs 251 00:09:39,710 --> 00:09:38,310 I remember when when I was looking at it 252 00:09:41,509 --> 00:09:39,720 through my camera and because I'm 253 00:09:43,370 --> 00:09:41,519 getting old now my eyesight is going and 254 00:09:45,579 --> 00:09:43,380 when I looked at it on the back of the 255 00:09:48,680 --> 00:09:45,589 camera it looked like this really weird 256 00:09:50,120 --> 00:09:48,690 star-shaped thing coming towards me but 257 00:09:52,069 --> 00:09:50,130 then every I reviewed the footage later 258 00:09:53,449 --> 00:09:52,079 and he was just he was just not 259 00:09:55,400 --> 00:09:53,459 star-shaped it normally was just my bad 260 00:09:57,860 --> 00:09:55,410 eyesight so that's something that comes 261 00:10:00,199 --> 00:09:57,870 into play as well say a viewer you've 262 00:10:02,809 --> 00:10:00,209 been interested in in UFOs for a long 263 00:10:04,400 --> 00:10:02,819 time I have ever since I was in 264 00:10:06,139 --> 00:10:04,410 elementary school I would read the books 265 00:10:09,050 --> 00:10:06,149 in the library and that's how I first 266 00:10:10,850 --> 00:10:09,060 got into it yeah me too I was I was 267 00:10:13,970 --> 00:10:10,860 almost very into UFOs I used to read 268 00:10:16,910 --> 00:10:13,980 magazines that have cases and had a 269 00:10:18,860 --> 00:10:16,920 bunch of books on UFOs because yeah big 270 00:10:20,090 --> 00:10:18,870 in science fiction as well I imagine if 271 00:10:23,059 --> 00:10:20,100 you're a UFO person you like science 272 00:10:24,800 --> 00:10:23,069 fiction it seems to be a common a common 273 00:10:26,720 --> 00:10:24,810 trait I read a lot of science fiction 274 00:10:29,720 --> 00:10:26,730 and there's like classics like arthur c 275 00:10:31,519 --> 00:10:29,730 clarke that's gonna get into the the 276 00:10:33,530 --> 00:10:31,529 three videos that people have been 277 00:10:34,879 --> 00:10:33,540 talking about recently there's these 278 00:10:36,740 --> 00:10:34,889 three videos they've been around for a 279 00:10:38,629 --> 00:10:36,750 while there's the one from the nimitz 280 00:10:41,930 --> 00:10:38,639 encounter has been around for like since 281 00:10:45,110 --> 00:10:41,940 2007 I think rare and the incident I 282 00:10:47,650 --> 00:10:45,120 think was or 2004 was it yes yeah so he 283 00:10:50,240 --> 00:10:47,660 came out like three years after that 284 00:10:52,670 --> 00:10:50,250 ones I think in many ways that's the 285 00:10:54,350 --> 00:10:52,680 most interesting one in terms of the 286 00:10:57,050 --> 00:10:54,360 incident the overall incident because 287 00:10:58,850 --> 00:10:57,060 there's so many people who said 288 00:11:01,009 --> 00:10:58,860 something happened you know it seemed 289 00:11:03,439 --> 00:11:01,019 like something something happened that 290 00:11:04,490 --> 00:11:03,449 day was not entirely sure what happened 291 00:11:06,770 --> 00:11:04,500 but you know there's all these different 292 00:11:10,100 --> 00:11:06,780 people so this was in 2000 293 00:11:14,390 --> 00:11:10,110 or the Nimitz battlecruiser was ahead of 294 00:11:16,580 --> 00:11:14,400 like a fleet of ships and they were 295 00:11:20,090 --> 00:11:16,590 getting these radar returns that seemed 296 00:11:22,190 --> 00:11:20,100 like that they were you know something 297 00:11:24,740 --> 00:11:22,200 flying around and then they sent out a 298 00:11:26,900 --> 00:11:24,750 plane at one point and then the guy like 299 00:11:30,020 --> 00:11:26,910 saw what he thought was a tic-tac shaped 300 00:11:33,440 --> 00:11:30,030 object zipping around and it flew off at 301 00:11:35,930 --> 00:11:33,450 high speed and then another plane took a 302 00:11:38,660 --> 00:11:35,940 video and you got this latest video new 303 00:11:40,910 --> 00:11:38,670 planes two planes started initially yeah 304 00:11:46,910 --> 00:11:40,920 total of four people right yeah that was 305 00:11:48,350 --> 00:11:46,920 commander flavor and his is WS oh I got 306 00:11:50,780 --> 00:11:48,360 us yes 307 00:11:54,320 --> 00:11:50,790 weapons systems operator and then there 308 00:11:58,490 --> 00:11:54,330 was a female pilot a younger female 309 00:12:01,010 --> 00:11:58,500 pilot who was doing high-level support 310 00:12:04,790 --> 00:12:01,020 for him and she saw what happened from 311 00:12:06,710 --> 00:12:04,800 above yes yes yes that's quite 312 00:12:08,030 --> 00:12:06,720 compelling really you got like at least 313 00:12:09,650 --> 00:12:08,040 two people giving their direct 314 00:12:12,320 --> 00:12:09,660 accountant if the other two have 315 00:12:15,530 --> 00:12:12,330 actually given interviews Jim slate the 316 00:12:17,270 --> 00:12:15,540 wso from commander flavors plane he did 317 00:12:17,840 --> 00:12:17,280 one interview but that's all he's done 318 00:12:21,530 --> 00:12:17,850 so far 319 00:12:24,770 --> 00:12:21,540 did he basically corroborate yes exactly 320 00:12:26,660 --> 00:12:24,780 what he's ever said yes they were 321 00:12:30,560 --> 00:12:26,670 actually on together was that on one of 322 00:12:32,780 --> 00:12:30,570 the that the shows like the the disco it 323 00:12:34,340 --> 00:12:32,790 is actually mainstream media I I don't 324 00:12:36,290 --> 00:12:34,350 remember the channel I talked to my head 325 00:12:37,520 --> 00:12:36,300 yeah it was on the news yeah back when 326 00:12:41,090 --> 00:12:37,530 there was a bit of a flurry of interest 327 00:12:43,550 --> 00:12:41,100 around probably at times thing came out 328 00:12:45,500 --> 00:12:43,560 yeah that's very interesting like what 329 00:12:48,920 --> 00:12:45,510 could he have seen and all these people 330 00:12:51,800 --> 00:12:48,930 co-operators yeah it's it's a bit of a 331 00:12:54,220 --> 00:12:51,810 puzzle like he he says he saw like he 332 00:12:57,140 --> 00:12:54,230 was looking down and saw churning water 333 00:13:01,280 --> 00:12:57,150 what are your thoughts on that whole 334 00:13:03,440 --> 00:13:01,290 incident well first of all I think it's 335 00:13:06,230 --> 00:13:03,450 not a good idea to focus on only the 336 00:13:07,970 --> 00:13:06,240 video I think that's a problem that your 337 00:13:10,280 --> 00:13:07,980 website has with all three of these 338 00:13:12,200 --> 00:13:10,290 videos or at least two of them I think 339 00:13:14,540 --> 00:13:12,210 that we should take into account what 340 00:13:17,270 --> 00:13:14,550 the witnesses saw because as you said we 341 00:13:18,980 --> 00:13:17,280 have three public aviators that have 342 00:13:20,150 --> 00:13:18,990 seen the same thing and then we also 343 00:13:21,980 --> 00:13:20,160 have multiple 344 00:13:23,869 --> 00:13:21,990 witnesses from both the Nimitz in the 345 00:13:25,970 --> 00:13:23,879 Princeton who corroborate the exact same 346 00:13:28,720 --> 00:13:25,980 story different aspects of the same 347 00:13:31,069 --> 00:13:28,730 story but they all tell the same tale 348 00:13:34,069 --> 00:13:31,079 along the same lines of each other and 349 00:13:37,189 --> 00:13:34,079 then if you have radar and visual 350 00:13:38,990 --> 00:13:37,199 contact to me that's a genuine UFO even 351 00:13:40,639 --> 00:13:39,000 even though we didn't have the video of 352 00:13:42,590 --> 00:13:40,649 the initial contact of the merge plot 353 00:13:45,350 --> 00:13:42,600 point where three people three public 354 00:13:48,079 --> 00:13:45,360 witnesses saw it we still have the radar 355 00:13:50,749 --> 00:13:48,089 in the same spot and yes it is possible 356 00:13:53,480 --> 00:13:50,759 that it's different objects but I think 357 00:13:54,920 --> 00:13:53,490 it's very likely that the tic-tock was 358 00:13:56,389 --> 00:13:54,930 the object that they saw on radar 359 00:13:59,499 --> 00:13:56,399 because it's in the same place and they 360 00:14:04,970 --> 00:13:59,509 saw it visually they didn't see the 361 00:14:07,879 --> 00:14:04,980 tic-tac craft depart the the area like 362 00:14:10,910 --> 00:14:07,889 flava says he flew away but no one says 363 00:14:14,119 --> 00:14:10,920 they saw it fly away on the radar I'm 364 00:14:16,340 --> 00:14:14,129 not really 100% sure on this I've asked 365 00:14:19,160 --> 00:14:16,350 Kevin day and he hasn't responded to my 366 00:14:22,550 --> 00:14:19,170 most recent question but definitely they 367 00:14:24,350 --> 00:14:22,560 saw on radar the object zoom from the 368 00:14:26,059 --> 00:14:24,360 merge plot point which is where 369 00:14:29,059 --> 00:14:26,069 commander flavor first encountered it 370 00:14:31,040 --> 00:14:29,069 and then from there in under two seconds 371 00:14:33,559 --> 00:14:31,050 it's over the horizon so hypersonic 372 00:14:36,079 --> 00:14:33,569 speeds we have there observe and also 373 00:14:37,790 --> 00:14:36,089 commit or Kevin days said that we saw 374 00:14:39,980 --> 00:14:37,800 that on radar and that the tic-tock 375 00:14:41,809 --> 00:14:39,990 object went directly to the cap point 376 00:14:44,150 --> 00:14:41,819 which is the combat air patrol point 377 00:14:46,550 --> 00:14:44,160 they were using for training so somehow 378 00:14:48,470 --> 00:14:46,560 this object knew the precise location of 379 00:14:50,990 --> 00:14:48,480 that training coordinate and then it 380 00:14:53,509 --> 00:14:51,000 zoomed there from their encounter yeah 381 00:14:55,370 --> 00:14:53,519 doesn't described it as zoom that if 382 00:14:58,970 --> 00:14:55,380 they just said it's now actual cap point 383 00:15:01,370 --> 00:14:58,980 they didn't show it moving right but 384 00:15:03,530 --> 00:15:01,380 commander favor described it as zooming 385 00:15:06,049 --> 00:15:03,540 across his tail and this was seen by the 386 00:15:08,660 --> 00:15:06,059 20,000 foot high cover which is the 387 00:15:11,059 --> 00:15:08,670 terminal pile yeah it zoomed somewhere 388 00:15:12,910 --> 00:15:11,069 the big problem you know it's like you 389 00:15:15,460 --> 00:15:12,920 get these eyewitness accounts of 390 00:15:19,519 --> 00:15:15,470 movement and then you get these 391 00:15:21,319 --> 00:15:19,529 recollections of radar art movement but 392 00:15:23,240 --> 00:15:21,329 they they don't they don't share the 393 00:15:25,819 --> 00:15:23,250 same thing like you you see the radar 394 00:15:28,639 --> 00:15:25,829 says you know Kevin day you talked about 395 00:15:30,019 --> 00:15:28,649 he was the guy who was I guess operating 396 00:15:33,300 --> 00:15:30,029 the it wouldn't read you call just the 397 00:15:38,069 --> 00:15:33,310 radar the whole system the CIS thing 398 00:15:39,780 --> 00:15:38,079 the CEC CEC yes yeah yeah that's kind of 399 00:15:41,939 --> 00:15:39,790 already called for combating engagement 400 00:15:43,769 --> 00:15:41,949 center or something something like that 401 00:15:46,800 --> 00:15:43,779 it's a cooperative radar system right 402 00:15:48,509 --> 00:15:46,810 yeah so it synthesizes puts together all 403 00:15:51,480 --> 00:15:48,519 the data from different systems so you 404 00:15:53,009 --> 00:15:51,490 can see it on one screen and should be 405 00:15:56,730 --> 00:15:53,019 really good obviously because you've got 406 00:16:00,660 --> 00:15:56,740 all these inputs but so he says that he 407 00:16:02,670 --> 00:16:00,670 saw it dropping from 80,000 feet 20,000 408 00:16:04,710 --> 00:16:02,680 feet and then dropping from I don't know 409 00:16:06,629 --> 00:16:04,720 where it's 28,000 feet 50 feet or 410 00:16:08,999 --> 00:16:06,639 something like that so you've got these 411 00:16:11,100 --> 00:16:09,009 recollections of this radar data showing 412 00:16:14,489 --> 00:16:11,110 one thing but then you don't have the 413 00:16:16,679 --> 00:16:14,499 eyewitnesses showing it dropping you 414 00:16:19,439 --> 00:16:16,689 have them showing it like it's exacting 415 00:16:21,660 --> 00:16:19,449 around where they are you know being at 416 00:16:23,939 --> 00:16:21,670 the ocean surface and then you have them 417 00:16:27,389 --> 00:16:23,949 going away so you don't get this this 418 00:16:31,530 --> 00:16:27,399 this exact match between video and 419 00:16:33,449 --> 00:16:31,540 eyewitness and radar and the video is 420 00:16:35,970 --> 00:16:33,459 completely different again like the 421 00:16:37,410 --> 00:16:35,980 video just shows like a distant thing 422 00:16:39,629 --> 00:16:37,420 that you know it looks like it's just 423 00:16:43,110 --> 00:16:39,639 flying away it doesn't really move other 424 00:16:47,490 --> 00:16:43,120 than getting a bit smaller hmm so I mean 425 00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:47,500 like would you consider this really to 426 00:16:53,460 --> 00:16:51,370 be the same thing I can't say with 100% 427 00:16:55,980 --> 00:16:53,470 certainty that all of these objects are 428 00:16:57,600 --> 00:16:55,990 the same but I can say that in my 429 00:16:59,970 --> 00:16:57,610 opinion I think that they're definitely 430 00:17:01,710 --> 00:16:59,980 related so I don't know if you're 431 00:17:04,049 --> 00:17:01,720 familiar with all of the witnesses but 432 00:17:06,419 --> 00:17:04,059 there's a person on board the Nimitz 433 00:17:09,210 --> 00:17:06,429 called PJ Hughes and he's in charge of 434 00:17:10,679 --> 00:17:09,220 the e-2 Hawkeye radar tapes so that's a 435 00:17:13,020 --> 00:17:10,689 radar plane that was flying around at 436 00:17:14,549 --> 00:17:13,030 the time and commander favor has said 437 00:17:16,679 --> 00:17:14,559 that this plane could see the tic-tock 438 00:17:19,380 --> 00:17:16,689 objects on radar there's a bit of a 439 00:17:20,579 --> 00:17:19,390 discrepancy with that because Dave BD 440 00:17:22,829 --> 00:17:20,589 who made the Nimitz encounter 441 00:17:24,720 --> 00:17:22,839 documentary he told me that at least at 442 00:17:26,669 --> 00:17:24,730 one point the windows were open and the 443 00:17:27,990 --> 00:17:26,679 radar was off on this plane but if it 444 00:17:30,659 --> 00:17:28,000 did make radar contact 445 00:17:33,510 --> 00:17:30,669 that's another plane in the sky that was 446 00:17:34,980 --> 00:17:33,520 seeing all of these things basically the 447 00:17:37,740 --> 00:17:34,990 entire time that it was airborne and 448 00:17:39,779 --> 00:17:37,750 those tapes were confiscated by Air 449 00:17:42,419 --> 00:17:39,789 Force officials according to PJ Hughes 450 00:17:44,159 --> 00:17:42,429 so that's a bit anomalous why is the Air 451 00:17:45,240 --> 00:17:44,169 Force coming onboard the Nimitz but so 452 00:17:47,080 --> 00:17:45,250 yeah that's very interesting 453 00:17:50,409 --> 00:17:47,090 okay the men in black type things 454 00:17:53,560 --> 00:17:50,419 the riot house it and I think the other 455 00:17:55,269 --> 00:17:53,570 guy a opj here is Patrick Hughes yeah I 456 00:17:58,690 --> 00:17:55,279 talked to him on Facebook and I asked 457 00:18:00,190 --> 00:17:58,700 him if the radar showed the departing 458 00:18:02,830 --> 00:18:00,200 and and he said I should talk to Kevin 459 00:18:05,259 --> 00:18:02,840 day and can I talk to Kevin day and he 460 00:18:07,450 --> 00:18:05,269 did right yeah say it did sir 461 00:18:09,580 --> 00:18:07,460 so PJ Hughes I don't think he's actually 462 00:18:11,440 --> 00:18:09,590 seen the radar data I think he was just 463 00:18:13,570 --> 00:18:11,450 in charge of holding the tape some safe 464 00:18:15,580 --> 00:18:13,580 and but he says that his friend Roger 465 00:18:17,080 --> 00:18:15,590 who was on board that e 2 plane he said 466 00:18:19,029 --> 00:18:17,090 he could look out the window and see a 467 00:18:21,129 --> 00:18:19,039 tic-tac right next to his plane so 468 00:18:22,899 --> 00:18:21,139 because we have multiple objects being 469 00:18:25,629 --> 00:18:22,909 tracked on radar by the by the Princeton 470 00:18:27,820 --> 00:18:25,639 over that two-week period and because we 471 00:18:29,739 --> 00:18:27,830 have multiple objects apparently being 472 00:18:31,480 --> 00:18:29,749 seen by multiple different planes at the 473 00:18:33,850 --> 00:18:31,490 same time or around the same time I 474 00:18:36,369 --> 00:18:33,860 think even if the objects aren't the 475 00:18:39,220 --> 00:18:36,379 same from the video the radar and the 476 00:18:41,259 --> 00:18:39,230 visual sighting or sightings I think 477 00:18:44,590 --> 00:18:41,269 that they are probably related in some 478 00:18:48,820 --> 00:18:44,600 way well they're all in the same space 479 00:18:53,710 --> 00:18:48,830 and time exact and they yeah the other 480 00:18:57,340 --> 00:18:53,720 guy Gary Voorhis and he he was a and I 481 00:18:59,590 --> 00:18:57,350 witness to it and he said that what was 482 00:19:02,710 --> 00:18:59,600 his name Roger could see it out of the 483 00:19:04,450 --> 00:19:02,720 window of the plane carry of or he said 484 00:19:06,700 --> 00:19:04,460 that you could see it from from the deck 485 00:19:09,340 --> 00:19:06,710 of the Nimitz using binoculars they have 486 00:19:13,119 --> 00:19:09,350 these big 20x binoculars called big eyes 487 00:19:14,379 --> 00:19:13,129 that mounted on on these platforms above 488 00:19:15,460 --> 00:19:14,389 the deck and you can see him through 489 00:19:16,869 --> 00:19:15,470 that he said he could even see it 490 00:19:19,029 --> 00:19:16,879 through their own personal binoculars 491 00:19:21,879 --> 00:19:19,039 and he says that you could see them for 492 00:19:23,590 --> 00:19:21,889 days I think he said that they looked 493 00:19:26,619 --> 00:19:23,600 like little points of light which is why 494 00:19:29,440 --> 00:19:26,629 we call them tic tacs and I could be 495 00:19:31,960 --> 00:19:29,450 slightly misquoting him there but you 496 00:19:34,330 --> 00:19:31,970 know flavor describes this tic-tac as 497 00:19:36,789 --> 00:19:34,340 being this this oblong there's not 498 00:19:42,009 --> 00:19:36,799 belong this this you know something 499 00:19:43,779 --> 00:19:42,019 shaped a bit like this a capsule I think 500 00:19:48,609 --> 00:19:43,789 it's a technical term it's a cylinder 501 00:19:50,680 --> 00:19:48,619 with two domes on the end but you can 502 00:19:52,359 --> 00:19:50,690 you've got Gary Voorhis saying we saw 503 00:19:55,269 --> 00:19:52,369 these points of light and we call them 504 00:19:57,609 --> 00:19:55,279 tic tacs yeah I don't think that kind of 505 00:19:59,619 --> 00:19:57,619 rings true in terms of why they call 506 00:20:00,850 --> 00:19:59,629 them tic tacs I think you might be kind 507 00:20:03,970 --> 00:20:00,860 of forcing the back excellent 508 00:20:06,460 --> 00:20:03,980 on to that but a lot of what they 509 00:20:08,140 --> 00:20:06,470 described is just points of light so 510 00:20:10,240 --> 00:20:08,150 when people say they're seeing the same 511 00:20:11,560 --> 00:20:10,250 thing over and over again if they're 512 00:20:13,030 --> 00:20:11,570 just seeing like a white speck in the 513 00:20:17,020 --> 00:20:13,040 distance some how do you know it's not a 514 00:20:19,060 --> 00:20:17,030 seagull well I would say that the 515 00:20:21,850 --> 00:20:19,070 hypersonic radar tracking would prove 516 00:20:23,140 --> 00:20:21,860 that it's not a seagull yeah yeah and 517 00:20:25,570 --> 00:20:23,150 that the tracking you know obviously 518 00:20:28,060 --> 00:20:25,580 like the obvious can debunk your 519 00:20:29,740 --> 00:20:28,070 explanation for for radar is that it's 520 00:20:32,140 --> 00:20:29,750 just a glitch there's some some kind of 521 00:20:34,270 --> 00:20:32,150 problem with the system and we know that 522 00:20:36,370 --> 00:20:34,280 the were problems with with the system 523 00:20:37,870 --> 00:20:36,380 because they they said that we've got 524 00:20:39,310 --> 00:20:37,880 all this clutter we're gonna reboot the 525 00:20:41,470 --> 00:20:39,320 system take it down and bring it back up 526 00:20:42,940 --> 00:20:41,480 again and recalibrate it and that should 527 00:20:45,549 --> 00:20:42,950 fix it and then they did that and then 528 00:20:47,289 --> 00:20:45,559 they didn't go away so they they assumed 529 00:20:48,820 --> 00:20:47,299 yeah that they were real at that point 530 00:20:50,980 --> 00:20:48,830 or some people assumed they were real I 531 00:20:52,510 --> 00:20:50,990 think that it doesn't show that there 532 00:20:54,340 --> 00:20:52,520 was a problem with the system I think 533 00:20:56,320 --> 00:20:54,350 that they were just testing to make sure 534 00:20:58,360 --> 00:20:56,330 that these were in fact real tracks and 535 00:21:00,310 --> 00:20:58,370 not ghost tracks but as you said when 536 00:21:03,159 --> 00:21:00,320 they reinstalled the system it just got 537 00:21:05,460 --> 00:21:03,169 clear no it was definitely real yeah but 538 00:21:07,990 --> 00:21:05,470 it shows that they expect there to be 539 00:21:09,760 --> 00:21:08,000 problems from time to time it means that 540 00:21:11,590 --> 00:21:09,770 it's not an unexpected event and 541 00:21:13,450 --> 00:21:11,600 obviously we hear about false radar 542 00:21:15,549 --> 00:21:13,460 tracks all the time and even like the 543 00:21:17,080 --> 00:21:15,559 pilots say there's accounts of pilots 544 00:21:19,419 --> 00:21:17,090 saying like there was false tracks off 545 00:21:20,740 --> 00:21:19,429 my wing and things like that though so 546 00:21:22,390 --> 00:21:20,750 it does actually happen these these 547 00:21:25,030 --> 00:21:22,400 false tracks and there's up a variety of 548 00:21:29,080 --> 00:21:25,040 physical reasons for it like inversion 549 00:21:31,960 --> 00:21:29,090 layers and reflections off of big waves 550 00:21:33,549 --> 00:21:31,970 and things like that so they do happen 551 00:21:36,940 --> 00:21:33,559 but we don't know what happened in this 552 00:21:37,900 --> 00:21:36,950 case obviously but it kind of raises the 553 00:21:40,659 --> 00:21:37,910 question though what do you why do you 554 00:21:42,909 --> 00:21:40,669 think that the the Navy was so 555 00:21:46,299 --> 00:21:42,919 unconcerned about this large fleet of 556 00:21:49,659 --> 00:21:46,309 flying objects next to the next to the 557 00:21:52,780 --> 00:21:49,669 Carrier Strike Group I don't know I mean 558 00:21:54,700 --> 00:21:52,790 maybe they had seen it before and they 559 00:21:56,890 --> 00:21:54,710 already knew kind of what they were 560 00:21:59,020 --> 00:21:56,900 dealing with because on the East Coast 561 00:22:02,020 --> 00:21:59,030 those those pilots have said that they 562 00:22:03,970 --> 00:22:02,030 saw them nearly every day so it could be 563 00:22:05,740 --> 00:22:03,980 that this wasn't the the high command's 564 00:22:09,190 --> 00:22:05,750 first encounters with these sorts of 565 00:22:11,380 --> 00:22:09,200 objects and it was just kind of a 566 00:22:13,570 --> 00:22:11,390 curious thing for the newer people but 567 00:22:14,680 --> 00:22:13,580 commander favor was already a pilot for 568 00:22:16,210 --> 00:22:14,690 at least over a deck 569 00:22:18,970 --> 00:22:16,220 at the time and that was his first 570 00:22:21,280 --> 00:22:18,980 encounter with it yes but like I mean 571 00:22:23,680 --> 00:22:21,290 you didn't think that the Navy is just 572 00:22:25,390 --> 00:22:23,690 used to seeing alien crafts flying 573 00:22:27,370 --> 00:22:25,400 around or advanced technology and they 574 00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:27,380 have been for decades and they just no 575 00:22:33,430 --> 00:22:30,410 one's mentioned it before I don't know I 576 00:22:36,730 --> 00:22:33,440 mean into the cover up later with the 577 00:22:38,320 --> 00:22:36,740 whole conspiracy thing but as I said on 578 00:22:39,850 --> 00:22:38,330 the East Coast they saw those objects 579 00:22:41,920 --> 00:22:39,860 almost every day both on radar and 580 00:22:43,210 --> 00:22:41,930 visually and then those objects also 581 00:22:45,580 --> 00:22:43,220 followed them to the Middle East to 582 00:22:46,960 --> 00:22:45,590 their deployment in a war zone so that 583 00:22:49,420 --> 00:22:46,970 shows that these objects are either 584 00:22:52,780 --> 00:22:49,430 following the carrier battle groups or 585 00:22:54,310 --> 00:22:52,790 it's truly a global phenomenon and if 586 00:22:56,710 --> 00:22:54,320 anybody would know that it would be the 587 00:22:58,990 --> 00:22:56,720 Navy because they're in every ocean at 588 00:23:01,120 --> 00:22:59,000 all times well you know back in World 589 00:23:04,390 --> 00:23:01,130 War two they had a thing called a Foo 590 00:23:06,700 --> 00:23:04,400 Fighter which was a write a you know 591 00:23:09,370 --> 00:23:06,710 essentially a UFO like they had various 592 00:23:12,880 --> 00:23:09,380 theories about what they were you know 593 00:23:16,030 --> 00:23:12,890 all pilots see things in this guy at 594 00:23:18,970 --> 00:23:16,040 some point or another and you know I 595 00:23:20,740 --> 00:23:18,980 think again in there the stuff that they 596 00:23:23,710 --> 00:23:20,750 described in the Gulf a lot of that was 597 00:23:26,200 --> 00:23:23,720 described as being points of light and 598 00:23:27,550 --> 00:23:26,210 you know not not solid objects there's a 599 00:23:29,800 --> 00:23:27,560 few different versions of the solid 600 00:23:31,540 --> 00:23:29,810 objects mmm 601 00:23:34,960 --> 00:23:31,550 you know talk briefly about the other 602 00:23:36,400 --> 00:23:34,970 videos sure you credit for the go-fast 603 00:23:38,140 --> 00:23:36,410 analysis I thought you did a great job 604 00:23:40,090 --> 00:23:38,150 with that like you're doing all the math 605 00:23:41,830 --> 00:23:40,100 and proving the out stood in the speech 606 00:23:44,380 --> 00:23:41,840 yeah it wasn't to complicate it I think 607 00:23:47,140 --> 00:23:44,390 a bunch of other people don't - it is 608 00:23:49,300 --> 00:23:47,150 very simple trick and I meant to ask you 609 00:23:51,160 --> 00:23:49,310 if we know the field of view for the 610 00:23:53,410 --> 00:23:51,170 tic-tac which I think we do so we know 611 00:23:55,210 --> 00:23:53,420 how wide the field of view is and if we 612 00:23:57,880 --> 00:23:55,220 can estimate the size of the object 613 00:24:00,100 --> 00:23:57,890 whether it's a passenger plane as you 614 00:24:01,330 --> 00:24:00,110 have suggested or 40 feet long as 615 00:24:01,840 --> 00:24:01,340 commander favor has described the 616 00:24:04,090 --> 00:24:01,850 tic-tac 617 00:24:07,150 --> 00:24:04,100 if we know the size and the field of 618 00:24:10,020 --> 00:24:07,160 view can we not determine speed and 619 00:24:11,380 --> 00:24:10,030 distance from those two things well yeah 620 00:24:14,140 --> 00:24:11,390 to a degree 621 00:24:16,630 --> 00:24:14,150 yeah you just estimated it no yeah you 622 00:24:18,970 --> 00:24:16,640 you can say if it's this size then it 623 00:24:20,440 --> 00:24:18,980 must be yeah this far travel assuming 624 00:24:22,840 --> 00:24:20,450 that the field of it's not entirely 625 00:24:26,290 --> 00:24:22,850 clear what the field of view is because 626 00:24:27,460 --> 00:24:26,300 it changes no no that it describes what 627 00:24:27,960 --> 00:24:27,470 it is in the corner of the screen 628 00:24:35,610 --> 00:24:27,970 there's a 629 00:24:37,290 --> 00:24:35,620 field of view but from the specific we 630 00:24:40,040 --> 00:24:37,300 don't know the exact specifications of 631 00:24:42,810 --> 00:24:40,050 the the the appFolio system and 632 00:24:46,230 --> 00:24:42,820 apparently it varies between like 0.75 633 00:24:48,030 --> 00:24:46,240 or 1 degrees or 1.5 degrees so it's not 634 00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:48,040 exact so we can get a good ballpark of 635 00:24:52,740 --> 00:24:51,010 thing do you do you admit that the 636 00:24:55,140 --> 00:24:52,750 object is moving from right to left in 637 00:24:57,300 --> 00:24:55,150 that video yes 638 00:24:59,310 --> 00:24:57,310 okay yeah so then I just wanted to let 639 00:25:01,110 --> 00:24:59,320 you know that you the way you have the 640 00:25:02,940 --> 00:25:01,120 plot the tail of the plane on the left 641 00:25:06,000 --> 00:25:02,950 the plane would be there lying backwards 642 00:25:08,730 --> 00:25:06,010 yeah I know yeah I I mentioned I did 643 00:25:10,380 --> 00:25:08,740 that yeah no I did that someone pointed 644 00:25:12,510 --> 00:25:10,390 that out obsessed over straight away and 645 00:25:15,360 --> 00:25:12,520 I updated it but yeah that was just the 646 00:25:16,710 --> 00:25:15,370 first first plane I I picked and it was 647 00:25:18,870 --> 00:25:16,720 probably a mistake to try to read too 648 00:25:20,910 --> 00:25:18,880 much into this little bit that appears 649 00:25:23,460 --> 00:25:20,920 to be sticking up on one side because 650 00:25:26,370 --> 00:25:23,470 you can if you take a plane and you know 651 00:25:27,810 --> 00:25:26,380 it's it could be any type of plane and 652 00:25:30,180 --> 00:25:27,820 passenger planes have a fairly 653 00:25:31,980 --> 00:25:30,190 distinctive shape along but the military 654 00:25:34,320 --> 00:25:31,990 planes have a variety of shapes like it 655 00:25:35,640 --> 00:25:34,330 could be you know a Hawkeye plane as a 656 00:25:39,060 --> 00:25:35,650 very different shape because it's got 657 00:25:41,130 --> 00:25:39,070 that big radar on top and jets are tend 658 00:25:44,460 --> 00:25:41,140 to be chunkier and have their fins and 659 00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:44,470 rather different configurations so last 660 00:25:48,000 --> 00:25:45,970 question about that do you think that 661 00:25:50,430 --> 00:25:48,010 there was in fact a radar jamming during 662 00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:50,440 the time that that video was taken or do 663 00:25:53,430 --> 00:25:51,970 you think there was no radar Jimmy well 664 00:25:55,200 --> 00:25:53,440 I don't know I mean if they have 665 00:25:56,760 --> 00:25:55,210 something a radar jamming detector that 666 00:25:59,490 --> 00:25:56,770 tells them the radar is being jammed 667 00:26:00,990 --> 00:25:59,500 does that only ever go off when the 668 00:26:02,340 --> 00:26:01,000 radio is being jammed and did it 669 00:26:03,480 --> 00:26:02,350 actually go off I think I think they 670 00:26:07,350 --> 00:26:03,490 said yeah I don't know it was being 671 00:26:09,210 --> 00:26:07,360 being jammed I think I suspect it was 672 00:26:12,420 --> 00:26:09,220 more like the Chilean case where they 673 00:26:13,530 --> 00:26:12,430 thought it was you know 30 miles in 674 00:26:15,030 --> 00:26:13,540 front of them and it was actually a 675 00:26:18,600 --> 00:26:15,040 sixty miles in front of them because it 676 00:26:20,820 --> 00:26:18,610 was a bigger bigger jet well commander 677 00:26:22,680 --> 00:26:20,830 flavor has said that there was radar 678 00:26:24,240 --> 00:26:22,690 jamming and jamming cues and he said 679 00:26:26,040 --> 00:26:24,250 that under what has told him that and he 680 00:26:28,110 --> 00:26:26,050 says that it's visible on the tape the 681 00:26:31,020 --> 00:26:28,120 radar tape not the not the tape that 682 00:26:32,550 --> 00:26:31,030 we've seen but in the official incident 683 00:26:34,140 --> 00:26:32,560 report it says that Chad Underwood who 684 00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:34,150 was the pilot of the jet that took the 685 00:26:38,430 --> 00:26:36,490 video it says that in that report there 686 00:26:40,020 --> 00:26:38,440 was no official jamming cues so 687 00:26:41,180 --> 00:26:40,030 hopefully when commander braver goes on 688 00:26:42,890 --> 00:26:41,190 to Joe Rogan 689 00:26:45,710 --> 00:26:42,900 I think in November hopefully you'll try 690 00:26:48,890 --> 00:26:45,720 to clear that up a bit for us hmm and 691 00:26:54,620 --> 00:26:48,900 we'll be interesting yeah I should send 692 00:26:56,660 --> 00:26:54,630 some questions and yes yeah the official 693 00:26:59,300 --> 00:26:56,670 incident report for the the Nimitz thing 694 00:27:03,080 --> 00:26:59,310 that I think they say the plane did not 695 00:27:05,450 --> 00:27:03,090 appear to move like he just receded so 696 00:27:08,450 --> 00:27:05,460 my guy who yeah I'm not sure how 697 00:27:10,070 --> 00:27:08,460 official that is that report commander 698 00:27:11,750 --> 00:27:10,080 favor has said it's the unofficial 699 00:27:13,400 --> 00:27:11,760 official report so he says it's 700 00:27:15,170 --> 00:27:13,410 legitimate but I don't know if it's 701 00:27:17,120 --> 00:27:15,180 technically official so you would 702 00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:17,130 consider it confirmed the guy who took 703 00:27:22,190 --> 00:27:20,010 the video made this report about taking 704 00:27:24,440 --> 00:27:22,200 the video well I think there are a lot 705 00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:24,450 of inconsistencies between the witness 706 00:27:28,550 --> 00:27:27,090 testimony what we can see and also what 707 00:27:30,200 --> 00:27:28,560 appears in that incident report so I 708 00:27:32,180 --> 00:27:30,210 think there are a lot of variables that 709 00:27:33,980 --> 00:27:32,190 we still need to clear up what actually 710 00:27:36,680 --> 00:27:33,990 happened but I think it's clear that the 711 00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:36,690 object is moving from right to left yeah 712 00:27:41,390 --> 00:27:39,330 I know you can tell that from just the 713 00:27:46,580 --> 00:27:41,400 angle that's displayed on the screen 714 00:27:48,770 --> 00:27:46,590 yeah yeah all right so so go fast you're 715 00:27:50,240 --> 00:27:48,780 okay with that being something that's 716 00:27:51,050 --> 00:27:50,250 not moving that fast and it's in fact 717 00:27:54,530 --> 00:27:51,060 yeah 718 00:27:58,040 --> 00:27:54,540 1,300 feet do you think it makes any 719 00:28:00,920 --> 00:27:58,050 sense that it's a balloon no and I'll 720 00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:00,930 tell you why I think if you look at only 721 00:28:05,300 --> 00:28:02,730 go-fast alone I think it could be a 722 00:28:06,560 --> 00:28:05,310 balloon but the fact now I don't know if 723 00:28:08,420 --> 00:28:06,570 you've seen it but now we know that 724 00:28:10,790 --> 00:28:08,430 gimbal and go-fast were taken on the 725 00:28:12,920 --> 00:28:10,800 same day some people suggest as little 726 00:28:14,900 --> 00:28:12,930 as 20 minutes apart it's definitely the 727 00:28:17,660 --> 00:28:14,910 same flight crew the same people in both 728 00:28:19,820 --> 00:28:17,670 videos so I think that there's a very 729 00:28:21,890 --> 00:28:19,830 high likelihood not certainty but 730 00:28:24,290 --> 00:28:21,900 likelihood that the object we see in 731 00:28:26,300 --> 00:28:24,300 go-fast might be related to the objects 732 00:28:27,950 --> 00:28:26,310 that are supposedly seen in the longer 733 00:28:30,290 --> 00:28:27,960 version of the gimbal video which are 734 00:28:32,660 --> 00:28:30,300 flying in formation and if those objects 735 00:28:34,550 --> 00:28:32,670 are flying against the wind then I don't 736 00:28:36,500 --> 00:28:34,560 think it could be a balloon assuming 737 00:28:40,580 --> 00:28:36,510 it's the same on the same object in both 738 00:28:41,930 --> 00:28:40,590 videos yeah although it could be that 739 00:28:45,200 --> 00:28:41,940 you know if they thought that it was 740 00:28:47,180 --> 00:28:45,210 moving at a different altitude like it 741 00:28:49,490 --> 00:28:47,190 looks like it's down by sea level and 742 00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:49,500 the wind direction of sea level can be 743 00:28:52,890 --> 00:28:51,330 very different to the wind direction at 744 00:28:54,570 --> 00:28:52,900 13,000 feet 745 00:28:57,180 --> 00:28:54,580 and you actually be completely different 746 00:29:00,420 --> 00:28:57,190 directions sea level winds are usually 747 00:29:02,640 --> 00:29:00,430 quite slow and and you know they would 748 00:29:03,780 --> 00:29:02,650 know that I don't know like what they 749 00:29:05,730 --> 00:29:03,790 would do but they would probably think 750 00:29:08,490 --> 00:29:05,740 that they were I would think they would 751 00:29:10,350 --> 00:29:08,500 be going by the wind direction of their 752 00:29:12,180 --> 00:29:10,360 altitude which was twenty five thousand 753 00:29:14,790 --> 00:29:12,190 feet go fast 754 00:29:17,460 --> 00:29:14,800 correct so I was mostly talking about 755 00:29:19,500 --> 00:29:17,470 the gimbal footage okay we can you're on 756 00:29:21,210 --> 00:29:19,510 the audio there that they're saying look 757 00:29:23,310 --> 00:29:21,220 on the SA the situational awareness 758 00:29:25,260 --> 00:29:23,320 radar display there's a whole fleet of 759 00:29:27,030 --> 00:29:25,270 them and they're flying against the wind 760 00:29:28,919 --> 00:29:27,040 and the wind is a hundred and twenty 761 00:29:31,799 --> 00:29:28,929 knots to the west or out of the West 762 00:29:33,210 --> 00:29:31,809 so that's hurricane-force winds that 763 00:29:35,850 --> 00:29:33,220 these objects are flying in formation 764 00:29:37,790 --> 00:29:35,860 and against the wind in that strom of 765 00:29:40,410 --> 00:29:37,800 wind so I think that it basically 766 00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:40,420 completely rules out birds flying in 767 00:29:44,460 --> 00:29:43,330 formation or any type of balloons even 768 00:29:45,750 --> 00:29:44,470 if it has thrusters 769 00:29:47,400 --> 00:29:45,760 I don't think balloons are going to be 770 00:29:49,620 --> 00:29:47,410 able to fly against that that's strong 771 00:29:51,270 --> 00:29:49,630 of a wind well yeah I don't think the 772 00:29:54,090 --> 00:29:51,280 gimbal video there's the gimbal videos 773 00:29:55,320 --> 00:29:54,100 the one with the rotating shape on it I 774 00:29:56,970 --> 00:29:55,330 don't think that's a balloon at all I 775 00:30:00,030 --> 00:29:56,980 mean but I think anyone's ever suggested 776 00:30:02,400 --> 00:30:00,040 that would be able to because it's got a 777 00:30:05,070 --> 00:30:02,410 very hot heat source so it's certainly 778 00:30:06,720 --> 00:30:05,080 as a jet engine of some sort to clarify 779 00:30:08,460 --> 00:30:06,730 I'm just talking about the smaller 780 00:30:10,650 --> 00:30:08,470 objects in formation that have been 781 00:30:12,120 --> 00:30:10,660 described by lieutenant Ryan graves yeah 782 00:30:14,250 --> 00:30:12,130 and I know that you think that his 783 00:30:16,770 --> 00:30:14,260 witness testimony isn't necessarily 784 00:30:18,090 --> 00:30:16,780 reliable but he was on the ship with the 785 00:30:20,280 --> 00:30:18,100 flight crew he talked to them right 786 00:30:22,650 --> 00:30:20,290 after it happened he said that these 787 00:30:24,120 --> 00:30:22,660 these objects these objects information 788 00:30:26,910 --> 00:30:24,130 were visible on the longer version of 789 00:30:28,740 --> 00:30:26,920 the gimbal video so if that video ever 790 00:30:30,780 --> 00:30:28,750 comes to light I think that those 791 00:30:34,890 --> 00:30:30,790 objects are a hundred percent not 792 00:30:36,810 --> 00:30:34,900 balloons or Birds yeah well I guess we 793 00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:36,820 probably won't see unfortunately because 794 00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:39,010 yeah you know the Navy is in their 795 00:30:43,200 --> 00:30:41,170 recent statements have said that they're 796 00:30:45,210 --> 00:30:43,210 going to investigate it but the 797 00:30:47,400 --> 00:30:45,220 investigation will include classified 798 00:30:50,730 --> 00:30:47,410 materials so they probably will not tell 799 00:30:53,310 --> 00:30:50,740 us the results yes which is great for 800 00:30:55,520 --> 00:30:53,320 the UFO speculation industry we can just 801 00:30:58,290 --> 00:30:55,530 continue to argue about it for years but 802 00:31:00,270 --> 00:30:58,300 it's rather frustrating that we won't 803 00:31:01,380 --> 00:31:00,280 actually know what these things are 804 00:31:02,820 --> 00:31:01,390 maybe they will say that they've 805 00:31:06,660 --> 00:31:02,830 determined that they were not 806 00:31:09,270 --> 00:31:06,670 interesting at some point what about a 807 00:31:13,140 --> 00:31:09,280 I have this explanation of the rotation 808 00:31:16,080 --> 00:31:13,150 of a gimbal like I saying that it's a 809 00:31:18,660 --> 00:31:16,090 glare from you know an infrared thing 810 00:31:20,160 --> 00:31:18,670 and like you know something big yeah 811 00:31:24,419 --> 00:31:20,170 bright light gives a glare that's bigger 812 00:31:26,039 --> 00:31:24,429 than the object itself so and when the 813 00:31:28,980 --> 00:31:26,049 camera rotates it makes the glow rotate 814 00:31:31,380 --> 00:31:28,990 and the horizon is d rotate it so what 815 00:31:33,030 --> 00:31:31,390 do you think of that explanation I think 816 00:31:34,890 --> 00:31:33,040 it's totally plausible and I think you 817 00:31:36,990 --> 00:31:34,900 did a great job of trying to prove it 818 00:31:38,669 --> 00:31:37,000 with showing the lines that you can see 819 00:31:40,650 --> 00:31:38,679 in the video and you did your own 820 00:31:43,500 --> 00:31:40,660 experiments to to show that it actually 821 00:31:45,390 --> 00:31:43,510 does happen so I think that's great that 822 00:31:47,940 --> 00:31:45,400 you're trying to prove your theory there 823 00:31:50,039 --> 00:31:47,950 and I think it's a likely theory but the 824 00:31:52,080 --> 00:31:50,049 problem I have with with all that is in 825 00:31:55,350 --> 00:31:52,090 your video you said that Dave felch 826 00:31:57,299 --> 00:31:55,360 is an expert in FLIR cameras who has 827 00:31:58,770 --> 00:31:57,309 been working on this for a while and he 828 00:32:01,020 --> 00:31:58,780 recently gave you this footage that 829 00:32:03,780 --> 00:32:01,030 proves that it is just an out-of-focus 830 00:32:06,330 --> 00:32:03,790 jet exhaust and it's rotating because of 831 00:32:07,830 --> 00:32:06,340 the camera but Dave foutch does not 832 00:32:09,570 --> 00:32:07,840 agree with any of the statements he 833 00:32:11,220 --> 00:32:09,580 doesn't think it's a jet exhaust he 834 00:32:13,950 --> 00:32:11,230 doesn't think it's out of focus and he 835 00:32:15,990 --> 00:32:13,960 doesn't think that the rotation is just 836 00:32:17,850 --> 00:32:16,000 caused by the camera you know what I 837 00:32:21,390 --> 00:32:17,860 wanted to say is I don't think that he 838 00:32:24,390 --> 00:32:21,400 can be an expert on the the gimbal 839 00:32:26,610 --> 00:32:24,400 camera equipment and in analyzing the 840 00:32:28,799 --> 00:32:26,620 video when he supposedly agrees with you 841 00:32:30,600 --> 00:32:28,809 and then discounted as a novice with 842 00:32:32,460 --> 00:32:30,610 fundamentally different equipment when 843 00:32:34,380 --> 00:32:32,470 he doesn't agree with you because you 844 00:32:35,940 --> 00:32:34,390 you asked me to reach out to him for a 845 00:32:38,100 --> 00:32:35,950 direct comment and he did and he made it 846 00:32:39,900 --> 00:32:38,110 very clear what he thinks yeah well and 847 00:32:43,770 --> 00:32:39,910 I obviously disagree with them and I'm 848 00:32:45,510 --> 00:32:43,780 not basing my analysis on what he saves 849 00:32:48,690 --> 00:32:45,520 I'm basing it on the evidence that he 850 00:32:50,700 --> 00:32:48,700 created he provided I mean he he I 851 00:32:52,799 --> 00:32:50,710 wouldn't say he's an expert but you know 852 00:32:55,320 --> 00:32:52,809 he would be the kind of a technician who 853 00:32:57,630 --> 00:32:55,330 works with these cameras in the factory 854 00:33:01,500 --> 00:32:57,640 and he tests them out in the parking lot 855 00:33:04,799 --> 00:33:01,510 behind the factory and he takes takes 856 00:33:07,520 --> 00:33:04,809 video of planes and you know I just 857 00:33:09,870 --> 00:33:07,530 chatted with him for a while and we we 858 00:33:12,030 --> 00:33:09,880 there was two things I wanted him to 859 00:33:13,860 --> 00:33:12,040 test one of it is panning left to right 860 00:33:15,570 --> 00:33:13,870 showing that the camera has to rotate 861 00:33:19,500 --> 00:33:15,580 and he did that and he show that the 862 00:33:20,430 --> 00:33:19,510 camera does rotate and the other one was 863 00:33:23,040 --> 00:33:20,440 like getting a 864 00:33:24,840 --> 00:33:23,050 a distant jet with with a heat source 865 00:33:28,200 --> 00:33:24,850 and he got that and it showed it that it 866 00:33:31,650 --> 00:33:28,210 did actually look somewhat like the the 867 00:33:33,090 --> 00:33:31,660 video that we we see and if you combine 868 00:33:37,050 --> 00:33:33,100 those two things the rotation of the 869 00:33:39,720 --> 00:33:37,060 camera when in the panning and this this 870 00:33:42,110 --> 00:33:39,730 glare then you get what we see in the 871 00:33:46,410 --> 00:33:42,120 videos and I think you don't need his 872 00:33:48,690 --> 00:33:46,420 professional opinion about it you just 873 00:33:50,610 --> 00:33:48,700 need to look at the evidence that he is 874 00:33:52,380 --> 00:33:50,620 he has created it he's created like 875 00:33:54,900 --> 00:33:52,390 these nice little videos that actually 876 00:33:57,360 --> 00:33:54,910 demonstrated I think so I can understand 877 00:33:58,650 --> 00:33:57,370 that but I still disagree um first of 878 00:34:01,980 --> 00:33:58,660 all did you tell him to do it 879 00:34:05,190 --> 00:34:01,990 intentionally out of focus no no okay so 880 00:34:07,140 --> 00:34:05,200 it's just happenstance well because he 881 00:34:08,790 --> 00:34:07,150 uses these FLIR cameras every day and 882 00:34:10,530 --> 00:34:08,800 admittedly he's not an expert on the 883 00:34:12,720 --> 00:34:10,540 military grade so there might be a 884 00:34:14,820 --> 00:34:12,730 difference in clarity or he might not be 885 00:34:17,940 --> 00:34:14,830 an expert on the rotating system as much 886 00:34:19,350 --> 00:34:17,950 as just the camera but even as not a 887 00:34:21,300 --> 00:34:19,360 photography expert I'm not a 888 00:34:23,760 --> 00:34:21,310 professional photographer I can tell 889 00:34:25,200 --> 00:34:23,770 when a DSLR is out of focus and I can 890 00:34:27,510 --> 00:34:25,210 tell when my iphone camera is out of 891 00:34:29,250 --> 00:34:27,520 focus so because he uses these cameras 892 00:34:31,080 --> 00:34:29,260 every day I think he's at least 893 00:34:33,030 --> 00:34:31,090 qualified to say that the object we're 894 00:34:35,670 --> 00:34:33,040 looking at is completely out of focus 895 00:34:38,100 --> 00:34:35,680 and skewed the image is skewed because 896 00:34:40,230 --> 00:34:38,110 it's blurry and not in focus or he can 897 00:34:42,210 --> 00:34:40,240 say that it is in focus and the edges 898 00:34:44,370 --> 00:34:42,220 are crisp and clear and well-defined 899 00:34:46,530 --> 00:34:44,380 which is what he says for the gimbal 900 00:34:50,520 --> 00:34:46,540 option yeah unfortunately there wasn't 901 00:34:52,110 --> 00:34:50,530 really you know anything in the 902 00:34:54,420 --> 00:34:52,120 background that you could use to see if 903 00:34:57,960 --> 00:34:54,430 the infrared footage that he created was 904 00:34:59,310 --> 00:34:57,970 really in focus right the the clouds and 905 00:35:01,590 --> 00:34:59,320 the gimbal footage I don't think are 906 00:35:03,210 --> 00:35:01,600 really in in focus it's hard to say if a 907 00:35:04,470 --> 00:35:03,220 cloud is in focus especially in a low 908 00:35:06,750 --> 00:35:04,480 resolution video because they're 909 00:35:08,460 --> 00:35:06,760 naturally blurry anyway so if you make 910 00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:08,470 him a little bit more blurry I don't 911 00:35:11,550 --> 00:35:09,970 think the focus issue is really a big 912 00:35:14,100 --> 00:35:11,560 thing like one of these other objections 913 00:35:16,740 --> 00:35:14,110 was you couldn't see the wings of the 914 00:35:17,940 --> 00:35:16,750 plane okay and that you could see it in 915 00:35:19,800 --> 00:35:17,950 his but I actually talked to him about 916 00:35:21,330 --> 00:35:19,810 that and I showed him some video and he 917 00:35:23,190 --> 00:35:21,340 kind of agreed with me afterwards that 918 00:35:25,620 --> 00:35:23,200 maybe you wouldn't be here to see the 919 00:35:29,580 --> 00:35:25,630 wings of the plane in that initially in 920 00:35:31,320 --> 00:35:29,590 case ya not Chilean case you the glare 921 00:35:33,990 --> 00:35:31,330 is so big that it covers the entire 922 00:35:37,140 --> 00:35:34,000 plane and that's in a 340 which is a big 923 00:35:38,820 --> 00:35:37,150 engine plane yeah and I've seen the 924 00:35:41,370 --> 00:35:38,830 longer version the 10-minute version of 925 00:35:44,430 --> 00:35:41,380 that video and you can't even see the 926 00:35:47,910 --> 00:35:44,440 plane even in TV mode so it's very far 927 00:35:49,140 --> 00:35:47,920 off the Chile my way in yeah yeah yeah 928 00:35:50,700 --> 00:35:49,150 you can I think you can just make it out 929 00:35:53,670 --> 00:35:50,710 as a little faint speck right at the 930 00:35:55,830 --> 00:35:53,680 start in the visible mode in the gimbal 931 00:35:58,140 --> 00:35:55,840 he says that there's no heat spiking or 932 00:36:00,060 --> 00:35:58,150 variation in the jet exhaust so he says 933 00:36:01,500 --> 00:36:00,070 it's not a jet exhaust yeah I think 934 00:36:06,060 --> 00:36:01,510 that's just down to differences in the 935 00:36:08,250 --> 00:36:06,070 optics if you notice when that moves 936 00:36:09,630 --> 00:36:08,260 over like things like trees and phone 937 00:36:11,609 --> 00:36:09,640 lines and stuff like that you get 938 00:36:14,280 --> 00:36:11,619 spiking as the spikes are from 939 00:36:15,720 --> 00:36:14,290 diffraction which is basically like 940 00:36:17,160 --> 00:36:15,730 going around corners and the different 941 00:36:20,670 --> 00:36:17,170 shapes of the corners it goes around and 942 00:36:22,920 --> 00:36:20,680 makes these spikes and so the light path 943 00:36:24,870 --> 00:36:22,930 of the camera itself has all these these 944 00:36:26,580 --> 00:36:24,880 edges in it like the aperture and at the 945 00:36:28,830 --> 00:36:26,590 edges of the camera system and those 946 00:36:30,480 --> 00:36:28,840 those create spikes are different 947 00:36:34,530 --> 00:36:30,490 cameras have different amounts of 948 00:36:35,880 --> 00:36:34,540 spiking and different brightnesses of of 949 00:36:37,290 --> 00:36:35,890 glare will have different amount of 950 00:36:39,420 --> 00:36:37,300 spiking so I don't I don't really see 951 00:36:40,859 --> 00:36:39,430 that as being a huge issue I think 952 00:36:43,710 --> 00:36:40,869 that's just more down to differences in 953 00:36:49,890 --> 00:36:43,720 the situation of what he's videoing and 954 00:36:51,690 --> 00:36:49,900 the camera itself okay just one more 955 00:36:54,750 --> 00:36:51,700 thing on that if you don't mind no no in 956 00:36:56,910 --> 00:36:54,760 your video gimbal object their gimbal 957 00:36:58,230 --> 00:36:56,920 UFO need not be moving I noticed that 958 00:37:01,440 --> 00:36:58,240 you have the gimbal object I was 959 00:37:02,790 --> 00:37:01,450 completely stationary it's it was really 960 00:37:04,050 --> 00:37:02,800 just an extreme example just to show 961 00:37:05,960 --> 00:37:04,060 that it didn't teach me I mean it's 962 00:37:09,870 --> 00:37:05,970 almost certainly moving away from them 963 00:37:11,280 --> 00:37:09,880 okay well two things on that lieutenant 964 00:37:13,230 --> 00:37:11,290 Ryan Graves has said that the larger 965 00:37:15,120 --> 00:37:13,240 object was in fact stationary he 966 00:37:19,200 --> 00:37:15,130 mentioned that in unidentified Episode 967 00:37:21,329 --> 00:37:19,210 four so I would like to see if you do 968 00:37:23,130 --> 00:37:21,339 think that it is a plane or a drone with 969 00:37:25,800 --> 00:37:23,140 a jet exhaust that's moving away from 970 00:37:28,410 --> 00:37:25,810 the camera I would like to see you 971 00:37:31,560 --> 00:37:28,420 update that need not be moving Jif or 972 00:37:33,690 --> 00:37:31,570 gif and the video as well just so that 973 00:37:35,609 --> 00:37:33,700 you can see the object moving on the 974 00:37:38,250 --> 00:37:35,619 graph because I think as the plane 975 00:37:41,070 --> 00:37:38,260 reaches the apex of its turn it have a 976 00:37:43,620 --> 00:37:41,080 horizontal view of the object moving so 977 00:37:45,599 --> 00:37:43,630 we should be able to see some movement 978 00:37:47,400 --> 00:37:45,609 in the camera if the object is moving 979 00:37:50,010 --> 00:37:47,410 well I think it's moving 980 00:37:51,780 --> 00:37:50,020 almost directly away from the plane so 981 00:37:53,910 --> 00:37:51,790 he's gonna I understand that but the 982 00:37:56,220 --> 00:37:53,920 plane was behind it and then it moves 983 00:37:58,500 --> 00:37:56,230 off to the side at the apex of its turn 984 00:38:00,180 --> 00:37:58,510 so I think at one point we should be 985 00:38:03,600 --> 00:38:00,190 able to see some horizontal movement 986 00:38:05,820 --> 00:38:03,610 yeah I'm not sure I mean obviously we do 987 00:38:09,060 --> 00:38:05,830 see what looks like horizontal movement 988 00:38:11,540 --> 00:38:09,070 with the gimbal video I mean it looks 989 00:38:13,740 --> 00:38:11,550 like it's moving relative to the clouds 990 00:38:17,010 --> 00:38:13,750 but it's interesting so that's that 991 00:38:21,210 --> 00:38:17,020 other pilot said that it was not moving 992 00:38:23,970 --> 00:38:21,220 at all he did he wasn't very explicit 993 00:38:25,800 --> 00:38:23,980 about it but he definitely said I can 994 00:38:27,270 --> 00:38:25,810 send you the video he said this larger 995 00:38:28,800 --> 00:38:27,280 object that was significantly larger 996 00:38:30,720 --> 00:38:28,810 than those smaller objects was 997 00:38:33,060 --> 00:38:30,730 stationary and he gave this account 998 00:38:34,860 --> 00:38:33,070 where he said there was a large object 999 00:38:37,350 --> 00:38:34,870 that looked like a like a gyroscope and 1000 00:38:40,260 --> 00:38:37,360 then there was these five smaller 1001 00:38:41,550 --> 00:38:40,270 objects following it in a v-shape right 1002 00:38:43,680 --> 00:38:41,560 and he said the smaller objects were 1003 00:38:45,240 --> 00:38:43,690 moving and we can hear in the audio to 1004 00:38:47,520 --> 00:38:45,250 the gimbal video that they're moving 1005 00:38:49,380 --> 00:38:47,530 against the wind but in Episode four of 1006 00:38:51,240 --> 00:38:49,390 unidentified lieutenant Ryan graves said 1007 00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:51,250 that the larger object was stationary 1008 00:38:54,960 --> 00:38:53,530 and he definitely said that he just 1009 00:38:58,890 --> 00:38:54,970 didn't make a big deal out of it yeah 1010 00:39:01,380 --> 00:38:58,900 that would be interesting yeah well 1011 00:39:05,880 --> 00:39:01,390 let's move on to you're going to talk 1012 00:39:07,680 --> 00:39:05,890 about the UFO conspiracy yes like this 1013 00:39:10,590 --> 00:39:07,690 is like you know this that the blog here 1014 00:39:13,170 --> 00:39:10,600 is my my podcast is about conspiracy 1015 00:39:14,940 --> 00:39:13,180 theories and UFOs I think a really 1016 00:39:17,130 --> 00:39:14,950 interesting as a conspiracy theory 1017 00:39:18,900 --> 00:39:17,140 because once one hand is this almost 1018 00:39:20,960 --> 00:39:18,910 banal conspiracy theory that the 1019 00:39:22,920 --> 00:39:20,970 government is covering up something 1020 00:39:24,870 --> 00:39:22,930 they're not telling us everything they 1021 00:39:26,550 --> 00:39:24,880 know about something yeah it seems very 1022 00:39:28,620 --> 00:39:26,560 straightforward we're on the other hand 1023 00:39:31,050 --> 00:39:28,630 you know they're covering up aliens from 1024 00:39:32,970 --> 00:39:31,060 one another another planet which is that 1025 00:39:35,130 --> 00:39:32,980 just an amazing thing ever so you've got 1026 00:39:36,900 --> 00:39:35,140 kind of two extremes of the conspiracy 1027 00:39:39,150 --> 00:39:36,910 spectrum in one thing what's your 1028 00:39:43,680 --> 00:39:39,160 thought on the the government covering 1029 00:39:45,240 --> 00:39:43,690 up UFOs in some way well this is gonna 1030 00:39:48,240 --> 00:39:45,250 take a while but first of all I'd like 1031 00:39:50,190 --> 00:39:48,250 to correct a statement that Seth Shostak 1032 00:39:51,930 --> 00:39:50,200 made in your last show he said that 1033 00:39:52,830 --> 00:39:51,940 around 30 percent of Americans believe 1034 00:39:55,320 --> 00:39:52,840 in UFOs 1035 00:39:57,270 --> 00:39:55,330 I believe that's what he said and that's 1036 00:40:00,000 --> 00:39:57,280 not actually correct 33 percent of 1037 00:40:01,170 --> 00:40:00,010 Americans believe that extraterrestrial 1038 00:40:03,480 --> 00:40:01,180 visitation is 1039 00:40:05,069 --> 00:40:03,490 the explanation for v4u of those but 1040 00:40:07,559 --> 00:40:05,079 it's a much higher percentage of people 1041 00:40:08,819 --> 00:40:07,569 that believe in UFOs and believe that 1042 00:40:10,890 --> 00:40:08,829 the government is withholding 1043 00:40:13,319 --> 00:40:10,900 information from us I looked it up on 1044 00:40:15,180 --> 00:40:13,329 Gallup in 2019 and it's 68 percent of 1045 00:40:17,520 --> 00:40:15,190 Americans believe that the government is 1046 00:40:19,290 --> 00:40:17,530 withholding information about UFOs so 1047 00:40:22,200 --> 00:40:19,300 another thing I'd like to say is that 1048 00:40:24,809 --> 00:40:22,210 not all conspiracy theories are the same 1049 00:40:26,339 --> 00:40:24,819 they were not all created equal not all 1050 00:40:28,950 --> 00:40:26,349 conspiracy theorists are crazy 1051 00:40:30,450 --> 00:40:28,960 so Flat Earth might be on one end of the 1052 00:40:31,799 --> 00:40:30,460 spectrum and then you might have other 1053 00:40:35,010 --> 00:40:31,809 conspiracies on the other end of the 1054 00:40:37,680 --> 00:40:35,020 spectrum and I don't even see UFOs as a 1055 00:40:39,329 --> 00:40:37,690 conspiracy I see it as something that's 1056 00:40:40,920 --> 00:40:39,339 been officially acknowledged by our 1057 00:40:43,410 --> 00:40:40,930 government the president has been 1058 00:40:45,720 --> 00:40:43,420 briefed on UFOs Congress has has 1059 00:40:47,849 --> 00:40:45,730 classified briefings on UFOs so I think 1060 00:40:50,309 --> 00:40:47,859 it's very clear that UFOs are real and 1061 00:40:52,200 --> 00:40:50,319 we shouldn't keep asking people do you 1062 00:40:54,450 --> 00:40:52,210 believe in UFOs that's what you ask 1063 00:40:56,160 --> 00:40:54,460 someone about ghosts or Bigfoot but I 1064 00:40:57,809 --> 00:40:56,170 think UFOs are now officially 1065 00:41:00,750 --> 00:40:57,819 established and this goes into what 1066 00:41:02,150 --> 00:41:00,760 meteo Kaku dr. Michio Kaku was talking 1067 00:41:04,020 --> 00:41:02,160 about with the burden of proof and 1068 00:41:05,819 --> 00:41:04,030 sufficient evidence to prove their 1069 00:41:07,890 --> 00:41:05,829 existence but I think that it's no 1070 00:41:09,539 --> 00:41:07,900 longer just a fringe conspiracy theory 1071 00:41:11,220 --> 00:41:09,549 that UFOs are real and that the 1072 00:41:12,930 --> 00:41:11,230 government's withholding information I 1073 00:41:14,880 --> 00:41:12,940 think both of those are very clear that 1074 00:41:16,530 --> 00:41:14,890 it is real and that the government at 1075 00:41:18,420 --> 00:41:16,540 least knows more than they're telling us 1076 00:41:22,789 --> 00:41:18,430 what you know by real though we keep 1077 00:41:27,630 --> 00:41:22,799 saying it is real what does that mean um 1078 00:41:29,819 --> 00:41:27,640 verifiable we can check instruments to 1079 00:41:32,940 --> 00:41:29,829 show that they're actually there it's 1080 00:41:35,730 --> 00:41:32,950 not just a Bigfoot sighting that has no 1081 00:41:37,500 --> 00:41:35,740 video and no radar data it's the Navy 1082 00:41:39,829 --> 00:41:37,510 saying that we don't know what these 1083 00:41:43,020 --> 00:41:39,839 things are we see them on a nearly daily 1084 00:41:45,240 --> 00:41:43,030 basis that seems real to me it's not 1085 00:41:47,520 --> 00:41:45,250 fairies or ghosts or anything like that 1086 00:41:51,359 --> 00:41:47,530 like a Bigfoot sighting would be an 1087 00:41:55,620 --> 00:41:51,369 actual giant ape where UFOs are let 1088 00:41:58,020 --> 00:41:55,630 blips on radar so well just just the 1089 00:41:59,490 --> 00:41:58,030 blips on radar are real at least right 1090 00:42:03,210 --> 00:41:59,500 yeah definitely then they're real they 1091 00:42:05,099 --> 00:42:03,220 need to be explained yeah yeah so if you 1092 00:42:08,370 --> 00:42:05,109 don't mind I'd like to go over a brief 1093 00:42:10,620 --> 00:42:08,380 history of the conspiracy so 1947 we 1094 00:42:12,870 --> 00:42:10,630 have the Roswell crash initially it was 1095 00:42:14,670 --> 00:42:12,880 reported in the newspapers sighting an 1096 00:42:17,460 --> 00:42:14,680 army official that there was a 1097 00:42:19,770 --> 00:42:17,470 Treves flying saucer and then there's 1098 00:42:21,030 --> 00:42:19,780 also allegedly bodies so I'm sure you 1099 00:42:23,300 --> 00:42:21,040 already know about this but this is 1100 00:42:26,670 --> 00:42:23,310 basically the start of the modern 1101 00:42:28,410 --> 00:42:26,680 conspiracy about the cover-up so 1947 1102 00:42:30,510 --> 00:42:28,420 same year we have the twining memo 1103 00:42:32,280 --> 00:42:30,520 written by General Nathan twining who 1104 00:42:34,200 --> 00:42:32,290 later got a fourth star and became the 1105 00:42:37,290 --> 00:42:34,210 USAF chief of staff and then the 1106 00:42:39,750 --> 00:42:37,300 chairman of chief of staff and he says 1107 00:42:42,540 --> 00:42:39,760 flat-out the phenomenon is something 1108 00:42:44,370 --> 00:42:42,550 real and not visionary or fictitious so 1109 00:42:46,140 --> 00:42:44,380 when I say it's real I mean that it's 1110 00:42:47,700 --> 00:42:46,150 real to the Navy and I mean it's real to 1111 00:42:49,550 --> 00:42:47,710 the Air Force it's not something that 1112 00:42:52,470 --> 00:42:49,560 crazy people on the internet are 1113 00:42:54,090 --> 00:42:52,480 imagining or just making up it's 1114 00:42:57,150 --> 00:42:54,100 something that is verifiable by the 1115 00:42:59,100 --> 00:42:57,160 military and then B he says there are 1116 00:43:00,750 --> 00:42:59,110 objects probably approximating the shape 1117 00:43:02,520 --> 00:43:00,760 of a disk so he's talking about flying 1118 00:43:03,600 --> 00:43:02,530 saucers and then he goes into the 1119 00:43:06,860 --> 00:43:03,610 description of these flying saucers 1120 00:43:09,810 --> 00:43:06,870 metallic light reflecting no tail 1121 00:43:11,880 --> 00:43:09,820 circular or elliptical and shape so he's 1122 00:43:14,280 --> 00:43:11,890 describing flying saucers in this memo 1123 00:43:17,280 --> 00:43:14,290 very clearly and then two years later we 1124 00:43:20,190 --> 00:43:17,290 have 1949 FBI document sent to FBI 1125 00:43:22,200 --> 00:43:20,200 director J Edgar Hoover also sent to the 1126 00:43:24,480 --> 00:43:22,210 Army's g2 the Office of Naval 1127 00:43:27,150 --> 00:43:24,490 Intelligence in the Air Force Office of 1128 00:43:28,710 --> 00:43:27,160 Special Investigations and it says that 1129 00:43:31,080 --> 00:43:28,720 they had meetings in between all these 1130 00:43:32,610 --> 00:43:31,090 groups discussing UFOs and it also says 1131 00:43:35,040 --> 00:43:32,620 that the Army Intelligence has recently 1132 00:43:36,540 --> 00:43:35,050 said that the matter of unidentified 1133 00:43:39,090 --> 00:43:36,550 aircraft or the British term 1134 00:43:41,130 --> 00:43:39,100 unidentified aerial phenomenon otherwise 1135 00:43:43,440 --> 00:43:41,140 known as flying discs flying saucers 1136 00:43:45,600 --> 00:43:43,450 balls of fire is considered top-secret 1137 00:43:47,220 --> 00:43:45,610 by intelligence officers of both the 1138 00:43:49,440 --> 00:43:47,230 Army and the Air Force so they were 1139 00:43:51,420 --> 00:43:49,450 taking this phenomenon seriously all the 1140 00:43:53,220 --> 00:43:51,430 way back in 1947 1949 1141 00:43:57,210 --> 00:43:53,230 and if you don't mind I'd like to keep 1142 00:44:01,110 --> 00:43:57,220 going Sheriff so 1952 we have the 1143 00:44:03,420 --> 00:44:01,120 Washington DC flap so two sightings of 1144 00:44:04,860 --> 00:44:03,430 UFOs two weekends in a row and I'd like 1145 00:44:07,740 --> 00:44:04,870 to ask you do you know about this case 1146 00:44:09,060 --> 00:44:07,750 what do you think about this event was 1147 00:44:11,520 --> 00:44:09,070 that the likes that was seen over the 1148 00:44:12,870 --> 00:44:11,530 White House exactly in the Capitol 1149 00:44:14,310 --> 00:44:12,880 building yeah there's a famous photo of 1150 00:44:17,300 --> 00:44:14,320 that but it was shown to be just 1151 00:44:19,410 --> 00:44:17,310 reflections of the street lights 1152 00:44:23,010 --> 00:44:19,420 reflections with street lights and also 1153 00:44:24,420 --> 00:44:23,020 BBC recreation yeah I don't really know 1154 00:44:26,160 --> 00:44:24,430 very much about the actual eyewitness 1155 00:44:28,440 --> 00:44:26,170 account but we have like all kinds of 1156 00:44:30,390 --> 00:44:28,450 yeah events that happen where 1157 00:44:33,030 --> 00:44:30,400 people start looking up at the sky was 1158 00:44:35,400 --> 00:44:33,040 like the battle for Los Angeles which I 1159 00:44:36,780 --> 00:44:35,410 think right in World War two where 1160 00:44:39,089 --> 00:44:36,790 people thought that they saw things 1161 00:44:42,359 --> 00:44:39,099 flying over Los Angeles and they even 1162 00:44:43,980 --> 00:44:42,369 had like satellites focusing on these 1163 00:44:47,099 --> 00:44:43,990 things but they didn't really turn out 1164 00:44:49,740 --> 00:44:47,109 to be anything substantial I think you 1165 00:44:52,650 --> 00:44:49,750 know in cases where you see lots of 1166 00:44:55,770 --> 00:44:52,660 people pointing out things it's really 1167 00:44:58,589 --> 00:44:55,780 surprising that nothing really comes at 1168 00:45:00,180 --> 00:44:58,599 them it almost seems like it's it's it's 1169 00:45:01,560 --> 00:45:00,190 been where people start pointing at the 1170 00:45:02,940 --> 00:45:01,570 sky and saying do you see that and then 1171 00:45:04,710 --> 00:45:02,950 oh I don't see anything and then okay 1172 00:45:06,319 --> 00:45:04,720 look over there oh yeah I see something 1173 00:45:08,640 --> 00:45:06,329 and then everyone gets all excited and 1174 00:45:09,780 --> 00:45:08,650 they not they start pointing at things 1175 00:45:12,240 --> 00:45:09,790 especially if there's something there 1176 00:45:14,099 --> 00:45:12,250 like some flares or something or a plane 1177 00:45:16,920 --> 00:45:14,109 plane well that's what that's why I 1178 00:45:19,680 --> 00:45:16,930 think this 1950 suit 1952 siding over 1179 00:45:21,480 --> 00:45:19,690 Washington DC is a real UFO because it 1180 00:45:23,460 --> 00:45:21,490 happened two weekends in a row we had 1181 00:45:25,980 --> 00:45:23,470 military jets in the sky chasing these 1182 00:45:27,510 --> 00:45:25,990 things a united flight both the pilots 1183 00:45:29,550 --> 00:45:27,520 and the crew members they saw these 1184 00:45:31,710 --> 00:45:29,560 objects ground observers saw these 1185 00:45:33,420 --> 00:45:31,720 objects and they were seen on three 1186 00:45:36,180 --> 00:45:33,430 different radars both civilian and 1187 00:45:38,069 --> 00:45:36,190 military calculated at 7,000 miles per 1188 00:45:39,450 --> 00:45:38,079 hour so that's not just some people 1189 00:45:41,430 --> 00:45:39,460 seeing lights in the sky 1190 00:45:42,750 --> 00:45:41,440 that's Jets chasing something that's in 1191 00:45:44,609 --> 00:45:42,760 the sky with the physical radar 1192 00:45:48,059 --> 00:45:44,619 signature that's moving three times 1193 00:45:50,040 --> 00:45:48,069 faster than in the sr-71 s top speed so 1194 00:45:51,780 --> 00:45:50,050 that's very anomalous to me and 1195 00:45:53,520 --> 00:45:51,790 something that is verifiable and 1196 00:45:55,170 --> 00:45:53,530 something that we need to try to explain 1197 00:45:56,940 --> 00:45:55,180 because the official explanation was 1198 00:45:58,109 --> 00:45:56,950 just temperature inversion but everyone 1199 00:46:00,180 --> 00:45:58,119 involved does not think it was a 1200 00:46:04,950 --> 00:46:00,190 temperature inversion interesting like 1201 00:46:08,210 --> 00:46:04,960 three times as fast as the sr-71 it's 1202 00:46:11,700 --> 00:46:08,220 very fast faster than the speed of sound 1203 00:46:13,440 --> 00:46:11,710 wouldn't that be a sonic boom there 1204 00:46:15,240 --> 00:46:13,450 should be but wouldn't there be a sonic 1205 00:46:16,890 --> 00:46:15,250 boom in the tic-tock case these are 1206 00:46:18,480 --> 00:46:16,900 going hypersonic several times the speed 1207 00:46:20,040 --> 00:46:18,490 of sound and no sonic booms recorded 1208 00:46:23,579 --> 00:46:20,050 exactly so there's something that we 1209 00:46:27,020 --> 00:46:23,589 don't know either it wasn't going faster 1210 00:46:30,809 --> 00:46:27,030 than the speed of sound or there's 1211 00:46:33,770 --> 00:46:30,819 incredible reality altering physics 1212 00:46:37,410 --> 00:46:33,780 going on to move the air out of the way 1213 00:46:39,599 --> 00:46:37,420 is it good you could manipulate 1214 00:46:41,010 --> 00:46:39,609 space-time and move through the air with 1215 00:46:42,360 --> 00:46:41,020 the bubble and then you wouldn't have 1216 00:46:44,610 --> 00:46:42,370 sonic booms 1217 00:46:46,410 --> 00:46:44,620 or you'd be a non-physical craft some 1218 00:46:48,960 --> 00:46:46,420 sort of plasma you know the the 1219 00:46:50,730 --> 00:46:48,970 Alcubierre drive come around how to 1220 00:46:52,530 --> 00:46:50,740 pronounce it there's this space warping 1221 00:46:55,260 --> 00:46:52,540 driveway at warp space in front of you 1222 00:46:57,570 --> 00:46:55,270 you know if you actually do that in an 1223 00:47:00,480 --> 00:46:57,580 atmosphere and apparently if you do the 1224 00:47:02,670 --> 00:47:00,490 maths of what would happen in that all 1225 00:47:04,200 --> 00:47:02,680 the energy from the space warp still 1226 00:47:07,080 --> 00:47:04,210 actually has to go somewhere he still 1227 00:47:09,690 --> 00:47:07,090 actually ends up creating this 1228 00:47:12,300 --> 00:47:09,700 incredible basically a big explosion of 1229 00:47:13,890 --> 00:47:12,310 the air and just the very idea of 1230 00:47:16,020 --> 00:47:13,900 something moving something from one 1231 00:47:17,580 --> 00:47:16,030 point to another you know it's at Point 1232 00:47:19,140 --> 00:47:17,590 a it needs to get to point B and it gets 1233 00:47:20,870 --> 00:47:19,150 there in tenth of a second and it's 1234 00:47:23,400 --> 00:47:20,880 moving like ten times the speed of sound 1235 00:47:25,920 --> 00:47:23,410 it has to go through the air that's in 1236 00:47:31,080 --> 00:47:25,930 between so either you can have positing 1237 00:47:33,240 --> 00:47:31,090 some kind of teleportation or perhaps it 1238 00:47:36,600 --> 00:47:33,250 didn't actually do that and for me this 1239 00:47:39,120 --> 00:47:36,610 is a very big point strike against these 1240 00:47:42,450 --> 00:47:39,130 things that there were not any sonic 1241 00:47:44,580 --> 00:47:42,460 booms and there really isn't any 1242 00:47:47,550 --> 00:47:44,590 plausible physical mechanism for 1243 00:47:52,020 --> 00:47:47,560 avoiding them well then what would 1244 00:47:55,170 --> 00:47:52,030 explain the radar signatures I would 1245 00:47:56,640 --> 00:47:55,180 have to go with radar glitches yes as at 1246 00:47:59,310 --> 00:47:56,650 the same time that people are seeing 1247 00:48:01,430 --> 00:47:59,320 them no you know as we discussed earlier 1248 00:48:04,620 --> 00:48:01,440 we don't get any correlation between 1249 00:48:06,960 --> 00:48:04,630 eyewitness video and radar at the same 1250 00:48:10,830 --> 00:48:06,970 time we don't see it so no one saw it 1251 00:48:14,430 --> 00:48:10,840 come down in the no greater the two case 1252 00:48:16,230 --> 00:48:14,440 that they did have witnesses there there 1253 00:48:18,660 --> 00:48:16,240 was a jet in the sky and he said I'm 1254 00:48:21,000 --> 00:48:18,670 surrounded what do I do and they had all 1255 00:48:24,150 --> 00:48:21,010 this transpiring on radar but then this 1256 00:48:26,030 --> 00:48:24,160 this did this jet pilot measure their 1257 00:48:28,950 --> 00:48:26,040 departure speed visually 1258 00:48:31,400 --> 00:48:28,960 no it's it's that night so I mean it's 1259 00:48:34,140 --> 00:48:31,410 so they just it disappeared or flew away 1260 00:48:36,240 --> 00:48:34,150 you know depending on how close it was 1261 00:48:39,720 --> 00:48:36,250 it could look like like anything so you 1262 00:48:41,280 --> 00:48:39,730 don't have the pilot corroborating this 1263 00:48:43,170 --> 00:48:41,290 three times the speed of sound thing 1264 00:48:45,900 --> 00:48:43,180 that the radar did I mean you still have 1265 00:48:47,760 --> 00:48:45,910 you have something in a region then you 1266 00:48:48,990 --> 00:48:47,770 have a pilot going there and he sees 1267 00:48:50,520 --> 00:48:49,000 something in the region and people 1268 00:48:53,310 --> 00:48:50,530 assume that the same there's the same 1269 00:48:55,460 --> 00:48:53,320 thing but I don't think it necessarily 1270 00:48:56,990 --> 00:48:55,470 means they are the same thing 1271 00:48:59,030 --> 00:48:57,000 and really I got to keep going back to 1272 00:49:01,820 --> 00:48:59,040 this this site boom thing if you think 1273 00:49:03,740 --> 00:49:01,830 about the air between two objects it's 1274 00:49:05,870 --> 00:49:03,750 you know it's there you have to go 1275 00:49:08,599 --> 00:49:05,880 through that air which means either the 1276 00:49:10,370 --> 00:49:08,609 air has to be I didn't know vaporize or 1277 00:49:11,599 --> 00:49:10,380 it needs to be pushed out of the way and 1278 00:49:13,580 --> 00:49:11,609 if it's pushed it out of the way and 1279 00:49:15,640 --> 00:49:13,590 then it snaps back again Mir boom sonic 1280 00:49:19,490 --> 00:49:15,650 boom that's where you get a sonic boom 1281 00:49:21,020 --> 00:49:19,500 the way if you have a warp drive if you 1282 00:49:23,000 --> 00:49:21,030 have a warp drive are you sure that you 1283 00:49:25,160 --> 00:49:23,010 need to displace that air are you I mean 1284 00:49:28,220 --> 00:49:25,170 I the way I understand it is that you're 1285 00:49:30,290 --> 00:49:28,230 pulling space-time around the craft so 1286 00:49:32,420 --> 00:49:30,300 you're just pulling the air around you 1287 00:49:35,270 --> 00:49:32,430 and not necessarily displacing any air 1288 00:49:37,520 --> 00:49:35,280 you still topologically you still have 1289 00:49:39,620 --> 00:49:37,530 to go through the air because even if 1290 00:49:42,349 --> 00:49:39,630 you're warping the space to be smaller 1291 00:49:44,540 --> 00:49:42,359 you're still going through space it's 1292 00:49:45,800 --> 00:49:44,550 just all compressed together so you're 1293 00:49:47,900 --> 00:49:45,810 still going through that air but now 1294 00:49:49,490 --> 00:49:47,910 this air is all in one space so you use 1295 00:49:51,230 --> 00:49:49,500 even easily for worse in a way they 1296 00:49:53,930 --> 00:49:51,240 means you very very rapidly going 1297 00:49:57,320 --> 00:49:53,940 through a very dense region of air and 1298 00:49:58,910 --> 00:49:57,330 that's this Alcubierre drive this space 1299 00:50:01,730 --> 00:49:58,920 drive that people keep talking about the 1300 00:50:04,870 --> 00:50:01,740 warp space doesn't work inside planets 1301 00:50:08,480 --> 00:50:04,880 atmospheres for that reason that's why 1302 00:50:11,170 --> 00:50:08,490 and you know don't jump to Star Trek but 1303 00:50:14,810 --> 00:50:11,180 if in Star Trek you can't go to warp 1304 00:50:16,520 --> 00:50:14,820 whilst you're close to a planet you 1305 00:50:18,020 --> 00:50:16,530 you can't warp space when you're like 1306 00:50:20,030 --> 00:50:18,030 you know I guess in a gravity well but 1307 00:50:21,200 --> 00:50:20,040 also in an atmosphere because you get 1308 00:50:24,589 --> 00:50:21,210 all this the atmosphere would heat up 1309 00:50:26,750 --> 00:50:24,599 and explode basically so the warp drives 1310 00:50:29,570 --> 00:50:26,760 from what we know would only work out 1311 00:50:32,540 --> 00:50:29,580 you know it away from our planet hasn't 1312 00:50:34,310 --> 00:50:32,550 NASA accelerated a laser beam slightly 1313 00:50:36,680 --> 00:50:34,320 faster than the speed of light using 1314 00:50:38,480 --> 00:50:36,690 similar technology to warp drives 1315 00:50:42,560 --> 00:50:38,490 I'm gonna go with no on that because 1316 00:50:44,060 --> 00:50:42,570 that we're getting news before people 1317 00:50:47,120 --> 00:50:44,070 often talk about you know things very 1318 00:50:49,880 --> 00:50:47,130 fast in the speed of light but they're 1319 00:50:51,410 --> 00:50:49,890 not really going actually going faster I 1320 00:50:56,120 --> 00:50:51,420 think it might be something to do with 1321 00:50:58,010 --> 00:50:56,130 the superposition of waves and the 1322 00:50:59,480 --> 00:50:58,020 information is going faster than the 1323 00:51:00,770 --> 00:50:59,490 speed of light in a medium but you can't 1324 00:51:02,599 --> 00:51:00,780 go faster than the speed of information 1325 00:51:04,970 --> 00:51:02,609 cannot travel faster than the speed of 1326 00:51:07,550 --> 00:51:04,980 light in a vacuum that's going to be 1327 00:51:08,640 --> 00:51:07,560 like a hard physical thing in the 1328 00:51:11,700 --> 00:51:08,650 universe 1329 00:51:13,140 --> 00:51:11,710 as far as we know obviously aliens might 1330 00:51:17,670 --> 00:51:13,150 have figured it out and that's something 1331 00:51:19,050 --> 00:51:17,680 that Kaku talks about that's that was an 1332 00:51:23,250 --> 00:51:19,060 interesting thing Kaku said actually 1333 00:51:24,900 --> 00:51:23,260 Michio Kaku he says you know where we 1334 00:51:27,990 --> 00:51:24,910 made the mistake of assuming the aliens 1335 00:51:30,690 --> 00:51:28,000 are like us but they might be a hundred 1336 00:51:33,680 --> 00:51:30,700 thousand years ahead of us in which case 1337 00:51:35,850 --> 00:51:33,690 the laws of physics will have changed 1338 00:51:39,150 --> 00:51:35,860 which I thought coming from a physicist 1339 00:51:40,680 --> 00:51:39,160 was a pretty outrageous claim because 1340 00:51:42,060 --> 00:51:40,690 the laws of physics themselves aren't 1341 00:51:44,850 --> 00:51:42,070 going to claim we might discover some 1342 00:51:46,710 --> 00:51:44,860 some more refinements to the VOSA fix it 1343 00:51:48,000 --> 00:51:46,720 or maybe there's a new laws of physics 1344 00:51:49,410 --> 00:51:48,010 but it doesn't mean just if we wait a 1345 00:51:52,050 --> 00:51:49,420 hundred thousand years the laws of 1346 00:51:53,250 --> 00:51:52,060 physics are going to change and that 1347 00:51:55,290 --> 00:51:53,260 will automatically be able to have 1348 00:51:57,200 --> 00:51:55,300 faster than light traveling maybe we 1349 00:51:59,670 --> 00:51:57,210 never have flashed the light travel I 1350 00:52:01,470 --> 00:51:59,680 think he just meant that maybe our 1351 00:52:03,510 --> 00:52:01,480 understanding the laws of physics will 1352 00:52:05,520 --> 00:52:03,520 change oh yeah but I'd also like to talk 1353 00:52:07,320 --> 00:52:05,530 about the burden of proof things so he 1354 00:52:09,060 --> 00:52:07,330 said initially that it was up to the 1355 00:52:10,950 --> 00:52:09,070 government to prove that they're not et 1356 00:52:12,930 --> 00:52:10,960 and then he's walked back that statement 1357 00:52:14,460 --> 00:52:12,940 a little bit to say it's up to the 1358 00:52:17,160 --> 00:52:14,470 government to prove that UFOs are not 1359 00:52:19,500 --> 00:52:17,170 real and I think what this gets at is 1360 00:52:21,660 --> 00:52:19,510 the Carl Sagan quote extraordinary 1361 00:52:24,140 --> 00:52:21,670 claims require extraordinary evidence so 1362 00:52:28,920 --> 00:52:24,150 I was searching your Medibank site for 1363 00:52:31,140 --> 00:52:28,930 explanations for the jl 1628 case of the 1364 00:52:33,990 --> 00:52:31,150 japanese airline the cargo airline that 1365 00:52:36,150 --> 00:52:34,000 saw a massive UFO and the only 1366 00:52:37,950 --> 00:52:36,160 explanation you haven't heard of it I 1367 00:52:39,810 --> 00:52:37,960 don't remember it okay 1368 00:52:42,300 --> 00:52:39,820 well the only explanation that I saw on 1369 00:52:44,070 --> 00:52:42,310 your site is that it's a squadron of b-2 1370 00:52:47,370 --> 00:52:44,080 bombers and that makes absolutely no 1371 00:52:49,380 --> 00:52:47,380 sense to me because a craft that's four 1372 00:52:52,640 --> 00:52:49,390 times the size of a 747 was seen 1373 00:52:55,110 --> 00:52:52,650 visually and on radar by the FAA and a 1374 00:52:57,240 --> 00:52:55,120 b-2 bomber would have a tiny radar 1375 00:52:58,950 --> 00:52:57,250 signature the size of a bird so it's 1376 00:53:00,780 --> 00:52:58,960 obviously not that and the craft is 1377 00:53:02,910 --> 00:53:00,790 moving around at hypersonic speeds and 1378 00:53:04,500 --> 00:53:02,920 b-2 bombers are not even hypersonic 1379 00:53:05,250 --> 00:53:04,510 they're not even supersonic they're 1380 00:53:07,260 --> 00:53:05,260 subsonic 1381 00:53:09,900 --> 00:53:07,270 so there's almost no chance that that's 1382 00:53:11,340 --> 00:53:09,910 what it was and in my mind what he's 1383 00:53:13,860 --> 00:53:11,350 saying is that if you want to come up 1384 00:53:15,840 --> 00:53:13,870 with these extreme debunking theories by 1385 00:53:17,220 --> 00:53:15,850 the government or just average citizens 1386 00:53:18,900 --> 00:53:17,230 if you want to say that it's not 1387 00:53:21,150 --> 00:53:18,910 something outside of our understanding 1388 00:53:22,260 --> 00:53:21,160 you need to explain how a b-2 bomber 1389 00:53:25,590 --> 00:53:22,270 could possibly explode 1390 00:53:26,970 --> 00:53:25,600 well a scenario he I think when he made 1391 00:53:28,170 --> 00:53:26,980 that statement he said that the burden 1392 00:53:30,510 --> 00:53:28,180 of proof has shifted 1393 00:53:34,050 --> 00:53:30,520 he was very specifically referring to 1394 00:53:37,200 --> 00:53:34,060 these three videos from an a he was and 1395 00:53:38,970 --> 00:53:37,210 he was saying that he talked before that 1396 00:53:41,850 --> 00:53:38,980 about different types of evidence we 1397 00:53:43,110 --> 00:53:41,860 talked about uh I guess science like he 1398 00:53:45,300 --> 00:53:43,120 says well in science you want things 1399 00:53:49,620 --> 00:53:45,310 that are testable I can repeat a ball 1400 00:53:52,140 --> 00:53:49,630 and also quantifiable yeah and he says 1401 00:53:54,450 --> 00:53:52,150 that we now have that with these three 1402 00:53:55,860 --> 00:53:54,460 videos and because we have these three 1403 00:53:57,870 --> 00:53:55,870 videos and then he said that they showed 1404 00:53:59,940 --> 00:53:57,880 like impossible accelerations and things 1405 00:54:02,910 --> 00:53:59,950 like that then the burden of proof is 1406 00:54:04,320 --> 00:54:02,920 shifted and that's what I'm saying 1407 00:54:06,000 --> 00:54:04,330 is wrong if you just looking at these 1408 00:54:08,010 --> 00:54:06,010 three videos now you're saying that 1409 00:54:10,470 --> 00:54:08,020 there's all these other examples of 1410 00:54:13,020 --> 00:54:10,480 evidence as well that you know get the 1411 00:54:15,360 --> 00:54:13,030 same argument but is this stuff that 1412 00:54:16,770 --> 00:54:15,370 Kaku was not aware of before is this 1413 00:54:19,260 --> 00:54:16,780 does he really think that this is the 1414 00:54:21,120 --> 00:54:19,270 first time that there's evidence of this 1415 00:54:24,360 --> 00:54:21,130 quality or is there something special 1416 00:54:25,950 --> 00:54:24,370 about these videos well for that case in 1417 00:54:28,200 --> 00:54:25,960 particular the CIA and the FBI 1418 00:54:30,360 --> 00:54:28,210 confiscated the radar data so that goes 1419 00:54:34,590 --> 00:54:30,370 back to the cover-up and then in Blue 1420 00:54:37,920 --> 00:54:34,600 Book you had a deliberate intention to 1421 00:54:39,840 --> 00:54:37,930 debunk UFOs so all of the UFO cases that 1422 00:54:41,580 --> 00:54:39,850 pertains to national security didn't 1423 00:54:44,070 --> 00:54:41,590 even make it into Blue Book so you only 1424 00:54:46,580 --> 00:54:44,080 have sort of the lesser UFO cases in 1425 00:54:50,040 --> 00:54:46,590 this in this project and then you're 1426 00:54:51,450 --> 00:54:50,050 explicitly televising giving publicity 1427 00:54:53,340 --> 00:54:51,460 to all of the cases that you can 1428 00:54:55,230 --> 00:54:53,350 successfully debunk and then you're 1429 00:54:56,460 --> 00:54:55,240 hiding the ones that you can't debunk it 1430 00:54:58,620 --> 00:54:56,470 was very clear that that was their 1431 00:55:00,420 --> 00:54:58,630 intention and the civilian scientist J 1432 00:55:03,330 --> 00:55:00,430 Allen Hynek he's criticized them 1433 00:55:04,920 --> 00:55:03,340 repeatedly for doing this and also the 1434 00:55:06,750 --> 00:55:04,930 public was criticizing them at the time 1435 00:55:09,450 --> 00:55:06,760 for doing this so he wrote a letter to 1436 00:55:12,000 --> 00:55:09,460 the Air Force and other agencies later 1437 00:55:13,530 --> 00:55:12,010 to get a reexamination of Project Blue 1438 00:55:15,000 --> 00:55:13,540 Book and that's how we got the Condon 1439 00:55:17,580 --> 00:55:15,010 committee at the University of Colorado 1440 00:55:19,950 --> 00:55:17,590 where I went to school and that whole 1441 00:55:21,330 --> 00:55:19,960 scientific report was also rigged just 1442 00:55:23,220 --> 00:55:21,340 in the same way Project Blue Book was 1443 00:55:25,770 --> 00:55:23,230 and it's still used by the government 1444 00:55:27,750 --> 00:55:25,780 and mainstream academics to say that 1445 00:55:29,400 --> 00:55:27,760 there's nothing to UFOs but that's a bit 1446 00:55:31,260 --> 00:55:29,410 of a contradiction because in this 1447 00:55:33,630 --> 00:55:31,270 report it says a scientist with a 1448 00:55:36,030 --> 00:55:33,640 well-thought-out plan to study UFOs and 1449 00:55:37,200 --> 00:55:36,040 proper credentials should be supported 1450 00:55:39,330 --> 00:55:37,210 even though we didn't find any evidence 1451 00:55:41,430 --> 00:55:39,340 and it's very clear that they weren't 1452 00:55:43,590 --> 00:55:41,440 looking for any evidence because United 1453 00:55:44,970 --> 00:55:43,600 States Marine Corps Maj Donald Kehoe he 1454 00:55:47,760 --> 00:55:44,980 said that the United States Air Force 1455 00:55:50,430 --> 00:55:47,770 had a letter that said that the UFO 1456 00:55:52,650 --> 00:55:50,440 phenomenon is extraterrestrial he was 1457 00:55:53,940 --> 00:55:52,660 cut off the air by CBS when he was 1458 00:55:56,280 --> 00:55:53,950 talking about a Senate committee 1459 00:55:57,780 --> 00:55:56,290 investigating this sort of thing he says 1460 00:55:59,940 --> 00:55:57,790 the Air Force cut him off the off the 1461 00:56:02,760 --> 00:55:59,950 radio while he was talking and then he 1462 00:56:04,560 --> 00:56:02,770 briefs this condom committee and a short 1463 00:56:06,150 --> 00:56:04,570 while after that Edward Condon who's the 1464 00:56:08,820 --> 00:56:06,160 head of this committee he replies 1465 00:56:11,040 --> 00:56:08,830 there's there's nothing to this UFO 1466 00:56:13,230 --> 00:56:11,050 phenomenon is complete nonsense and then 1467 00:56:14,910 --> 00:56:13,240 he pauses and adds but I'm not supposed 1468 00:56:17,190 --> 00:56:14,920 to reached I'm not supposed to reach 1469 00:56:19,340 --> 00:56:17,200 that conclusion for another year so this 1470 00:56:21,480 --> 00:56:19,350 whole committee already had a 1471 00:56:23,340 --> 00:56:21,490 predetermined conclusion before they 1472 00:56:24,870 --> 00:56:23,350 even examined the data and that's why 1473 00:56:26,460 --> 00:56:24,880 you had half of the committee leave 1474 00:56:27,960 --> 00:56:26,470 halfway through because they had a 1475 00:56:30,540 --> 00:56:27,970 mutiny they didn't agree with the 1476 00:56:32,160 --> 00:56:30,550 scientific methodology so it's very 1477 00:56:34,140 --> 00:56:32,170 clear that all of these reports are 1478 00:56:35,700 --> 00:56:34,150 coverup and as you said the Navy has 1479 00:56:38,010 --> 00:56:35,710 said that all of this will be classified 1480 00:56:40,520 --> 00:56:38,020 going forward so it really is covered up 1481 00:56:44,070 --> 00:56:40,530 from the public and from academia so 1482 00:56:46,410 --> 00:56:44,080 recently like harry reid got a program 1483 00:56:48,990 --> 00:56:46,420 funded not recently it was like seven or 1484 00:56:52,590 --> 00:56:49,000 eight years ago which I believe was 1485 00:56:55,230 --> 00:56:52,600 called a a tip advanced aerospace threat 1486 00:56:57,570 --> 00:56:55,240 identification program and that was 1487 00:57:00,350 --> 00:56:57,580 funded so but you know like twenty two 1488 00:57:01,980 --> 00:57:00,360 million dollars over five years and 1489 00:57:06,500 --> 00:57:01,990 obviously their money got spent 1490 00:57:09,000 --> 00:57:06,510 somewhere was that part of the cover-up 1491 00:57:13,140 --> 00:57:09,010 this is going to be almost all 1492 00:57:16,170 --> 00:57:13,150 speculation but it could be part of as 1493 00:57:18,090 --> 00:57:16,180 many have suggested a drift disclosure I 1494 00:57:21,090 --> 00:57:18,100 don't agree with that I actually agree 1495 00:57:23,460 --> 00:57:21,100 with what sets Seth Shostak had said on 1496 00:57:25,650 --> 00:57:23,470 your last episode where it's almost 1497 00:57:27,660 --> 00:57:25,660 naive to expect a disclosure from the 1498 00:57:29,430 --> 00:57:27,670 government we can only pressure elected 1499 00:57:32,190 --> 00:57:29,440 officials and if they're not privy to 1500 00:57:34,380 --> 00:57:32,200 this sort of deep secret classified 1501 00:57:36,210 --> 00:57:34,390 information by black projects black 1502 00:57:37,860 --> 00:57:36,220 budgets if they don't even have the 1503 00:57:41,010 --> 00:57:37,870 access to this information they can't 1504 00:57:44,400 --> 00:57:41,020 possibly disclose it so I think it's 1505 00:57:46,080 --> 00:57:44,410 possible that what Bigelow did because 1506 00:57:48,960 --> 00:57:46,090 he was an integral part of creating this 1507 00:57:49,710 --> 00:57:48,970 a tip with Harry Reid he created a tip 1508 00:57:51,210 --> 00:57:49,720 they 1509 00:57:53,010 --> 00:57:51,220 spent this money have you seen the list 1510 00:57:56,070 --> 00:57:53,020 of experiments on the John McCain letter 1511 00:57:58,410 --> 00:57:56,080 yes I have already experiments or such 1512 00:58:02,790 --> 00:57:58,420 then what kind of like ethos and stuff 1513 00:58:04,430 --> 00:58:02,800 right warp drives so they spent the 1514 00:58:06,930 --> 00:58:04,440 money on that possibly also 1515 00:58:10,800 --> 00:58:06,940 investigating some you ApS trying to 1516 00:58:12,599 --> 00:58:10,810 identify them and after this funding 1517 00:58:13,920 --> 00:58:12,609 dries up he's gonna want to continue 1518 00:58:16,530 --> 00:58:13,930 that research right he's a private 1519 00:58:18,270 --> 00:58:16,540 citizen he's very interested in UFOs he 1520 00:58:19,859 --> 00:58:18,280 became a billionaire for the express 1521 00:58:21,450 --> 00:58:19,869 purpose of studying UFOs 1522 00:58:22,620 --> 00:58:21,460 so once his funding dries up he's gonna 1523 00:58:24,990 --> 00:58:22,630 want to keep going with the same 1524 00:58:27,839 --> 00:58:25,000 research that he had already going and 1525 00:58:30,570 --> 00:58:27,849 so he might have created ttsi secretly 1526 00:58:33,240 --> 00:58:30,580 which is evidenced by a selfie with him 1527 00:58:34,950 --> 00:58:33,250 lewis Elizondo tom delonge altogether 1528 00:58:36,750 --> 00:58:34,960 around the same time of that formation 1529 00:58:38,490 --> 00:58:36,760 and then TTS a would be a continuation 1530 00:58:41,880 --> 00:58:38,500 of a tip because it has many of the same 1531 00:58:44,670 --> 00:58:41,890 scientists Erik Davis who is doing the 1532 00:58:46,620 --> 00:58:44,680 meta materials analysis currently at how 1533 00:58:48,300 --> 00:58:46,630 put offs company which is called earth 1534 00:58:49,530 --> 00:58:48,310 tech who was also both of these 1535 00:58:51,690 --> 00:58:49,540 scientists were working on those 1536 00:58:54,810 --> 00:58:51,700 theoretical papers Lewis Elizondo is a 1537 00:58:56,970 --> 00:58:54,820 carryover Colm Kelleher is from the 1538 00:58:58,560 --> 00:58:56,980 needs NIDS investigation of the 1539 00:59:00,900 --> 00:58:58,570 paranormal activities at skinwalker 1540 00:59:02,160 --> 00:59:00,910 ranch also funded by Bigelow so Bigelow 1541 00:59:04,290 --> 00:59:02,170 is kind of using all of these same 1542 00:59:05,940 --> 00:59:04,300 people in a new organization that's much 1543 00:59:07,410 --> 00:59:05,950 more public and he also has the 1544 00:59:09,390 --> 00:59:07,420 advantage of having these three videos 1545 00:59:11,099 --> 00:59:09,400 that he might have paid Elizondo to 1546 00:59:13,200 --> 00:59:11,109 release or that the government 1547 00:59:15,480 --> 00:59:13,210 authorized for release and then he has 1548 00:59:17,460 --> 00:59:15,490 the legitimacy of the 8 a program to 1549 00:59:25,349 --> 00:59:17,470 back up his new public company which is 1550 00:59:26,760 --> 00:59:25,359 TCS a so I wonder do you think you feel 1551 00:59:31,560 --> 00:59:26,770 you feel things have changed in the last 1552 00:59:33,560 --> 00:59:31,570 5 years in terms of how UFOs are viewed 1553 00:59:37,339 --> 00:59:33,570 and how what information we have that 1554 00:59:40,589 --> 00:59:37,349 verifies that UFOs are you know real 1555 00:59:43,380 --> 00:59:40,599 it's a very tricky question on the 1556 00:59:45,630 --> 00:59:43,390 surface yes so we've never really had an 1557 00:59:47,160 --> 00:59:45,640 admission I mean you could say the Air 1558 00:59:49,560 --> 00:59:47,170 Force of the army back in the 40s and 1559 00:59:51,690 --> 00:59:49,570 50s admitted some things but we've never 1560 00:59:53,790 --> 00:59:51,700 had a direct admission in recent times 1561 00:59:55,950 --> 00:59:53,800 by the military that there are craft 1562 00:59:57,510 --> 00:59:55,960 flying around in our battle spaces above 1563 00:59:59,880 --> 00:59:57,520 our aircraft carriers that we can't 1564 01:00:02,310 --> 00:59:59,890 identify so that alone saying that these 1565 01:00:03,450 --> 01:00:02,320 are real verified you ApS that is a 1566 01:00:04,980 --> 01:00:03,460 change in the dialogue 1567 01:00:07,079 --> 01:00:04,990 and and the more interesting change in 1568 01:00:09,720 --> 01:00:07,089 the in the discord or the discourse is 1569 01:00:12,930 --> 01:00:09,730 the mainstream media all of the sudden 1570 01:00:14,640 --> 01:00:12,940 it went from 5060 years of being 1571 01:00:16,380 --> 01:00:14,650 ridicule and not being taken seriously 1572 01:00:17,940 --> 01:00:16,390 intentionally not being taken seriously 1573 01:00:20,819 --> 01:00:17,950 because that was part of the cover-up 1574 01:00:23,520 --> 01:00:20,829 you can hide it if it's ridiculed but 1575 01:00:25,710 --> 01:00:23,530 now the the Navy pilots are on the 1576 01:00:28,290 --> 01:00:25,720 mainstream media we have Louis Elizondo 1577 01:00:30,540 --> 01:00:28,300 public from a tip and all of these 1578 01:00:32,280 --> 01:00:30,550 channels in the New York Times they're 1579 01:00:33,690 --> 01:00:32,290 all taking it very very seriously and 1580 01:00:35,460 --> 01:00:33,700 they're saying it's real we don't know 1581 01:00:37,680 --> 01:00:35,470 what it is so that is the most 1582 01:00:40,440 --> 01:00:37,690 interesting public relations change that 1583 01:00:42,089 --> 01:00:40,450 I can see but as far as me personally I 1584 01:00:45,510 --> 01:00:42,099 don't think that we're headed towards 1585 01:00:47,700 --> 01:00:45,520 disclosure just yet but you you feel 1586 01:00:49,890 --> 01:00:47,710 that this change in the media thing is a 1587 01:00:52,319 --> 01:00:49,900 deliberate thing like the mini the 1588 01:00:57,690 --> 01:00:52,329 meteor is being directed to do this 1589 01:01:00,000 --> 01:00:57,700 somehow it's likely it's also possible 1590 01:01:03,180 --> 01:01:00,010 that they just realized that they can 1591 01:01:05,640 --> 01:01:03,190 make more money by playing up the threat 1592 01:01:07,829 --> 01:01:05,650 factor which is an unknown threat but 1593 01:01:09,839 --> 01:01:07,839 they can make more money by legitimizing 1594 01:01:12,839 --> 01:01:09,849 UFOs than they can by ridiculing it so 1595 01:01:14,520 --> 01:01:12,849 it was relegated to only tabloids and 1596 01:01:16,349 --> 01:01:14,530 now they've realized after the New York 1597 01:01:19,799 --> 01:01:16,359 Times article which in fact was written 1598 01:01:22,380 --> 01:01:19,809 by a UFO author Leslie Kean or Kane I'm 1599 01:01:24,539 --> 01:01:22,390 sorry and now they've realized that they 1600 01:01:26,039 --> 01:01:24,549 can make more ad revenue by publishing 1601 01:01:28,319 --> 01:01:26,049 these serious stories that a lot of 1602 01:01:30,030 --> 01:01:28,329 people read so it could be deliberate or 1603 01:01:33,930 --> 01:01:30,040 it could just be as everything else is 1604 01:01:36,180 --> 01:01:33,940 just money yeah I guess no so you don't 1605 01:01:41,390 --> 01:01:36,190 feel like disclosures around the corner 1606 01:01:44,670 --> 01:01:41,400 I don't and I also wanted to say that 1607 01:01:47,609 --> 01:01:44,680 Laurance Rockefeller had a meeting with 1608 01:01:50,010 --> 01:01:47,619 Steven Greer Robert Bigelow Linda 1609 01:01:53,520 --> 01:01:50,020 Moulton Howe all of these big names in 1610 01:01:55,230 --> 01:01:53,530 ufology and he also wrote a letter to 1611 01:01:57,329 --> 01:01:55,240 the Clintons to say that they should 1612 01:01:58,920 --> 01:01:57,339 press the government to do disclosure 1613 01:02:01,710 --> 01:01:58,930 and that's why I think both of the 1614 01:02:03,720 --> 01:02:01,720 Clintons in their presidential campaigns 1615 01:02:05,640 --> 01:02:03,730 made a move towards disclosure but 1616 01:02:07,260 --> 01:02:05,650 obviously that wasn't successful so 1617 01:02:08,849 --> 01:02:07,270 there might be something above the 1618 01:02:10,890 --> 01:02:08,859 presidency that controls this 1619 01:02:13,049 --> 01:02:10,900 information and we just can't get it 1620 01:02:16,950 --> 01:02:13,059 from our elected officials interesting 1621 01:02:19,320 --> 01:02:16,960 theory I have to say I personally 1622 01:02:20,550 --> 01:02:19,330 not agree with that I I feel like 1623 01:02:23,370 --> 01:02:20,560 there's really nothing there other than 1624 01:02:25,620 --> 01:02:23,380 that sometimes we get unidentified craft 1625 01:02:29,099 --> 01:02:25,630 in military airspace just because people 1626 01:02:31,680 --> 01:02:29,109 fly drones into there sometimes aircraft 1627 01:02:34,349 --> 01:02:31,690 go in there and sometimes enemy nations 1628 01:02:37,140 --> 01:02:34,359 go in there so that's kind of my my take 1629 01:02:38,910 --> 01:02:37,150 on on what's going on and I and my I 1630 01:02:40,859 --> 01:02:38,920 also feel that it's inevitable that you 1631 01:02:43,320 --> 01:02:40,869 will have some kind of unidentified 1632 01:02:45,359 --> 01:02:43,330 craft in every arena 1633 01:02:48,960 --> 01:02:45,369 I'm sure airline pilots see them all the 1634 01:02:50,609 --> 01:02:48,970 time you know I see my little white dots 1635 01:02:56,250 --> 01:02:50,619 in them in the backyard which I assume 1636 01:02:58,109 --> 01:02:56,260 are planes or Bert but but yeah I don't 1637 01:03:00,599 --> 01:02:58,119 really think personally though there is 1638 01:03:03,780 --> 01:03:00,609 this big cover-up going on it but it 1639 01:03:04,920 --> 01:03:03,790 would be great if if there was something 1640 01:03:08,520 --> 01:03:04,930 interesting going and that's something I 1641 01:03:11,160 --> 01:03:08,530 think Seth Shostak said that if if there 1642 01:03:15,510 --> 01:03:11,170 was a good chance a good indication that 1643 01:03:16,920 --> 01:03:15,520 there was a lien craft then he would he 1644 01:03:19,200 --> 01:03:16,930 would be studying it but he doesn't 1645 01:03:20,490 --> 01:03:19,210 really think that there is hopefully 1646 01:03:22,800 --> 01:03:20,500 we'll find out what's what's kind of 1647 01:03:24,120 --> 01:03:22,810 coming down the line by what what is 1648 01:03:27,359 --> 01:03:24,130 this stuff like there's supposed to 1649 01:03:30,300 --> 01:03:27,369 happen soon like well Bob Bigelow 1650 01:03:31,800 --> 01:03:30,310 definitely believes in UFOs and you just 1651 01:03:34,260 --> 01:03:31,810 mentioned the commercial airline pilots 1652 01:03:35,910 --> 01:03:34,270 actually they were instructed in the FAA 1653 01:03:37,980 --> 01:03:35,920 manuals to report all of their UFO 1654 01:03:39,870 --> 01:03:37,990 sightings to Bob Bigelow and so there 1655 01:03:42,990 --> 01:03:39,880 might be something going on with him 1656 01:03:45,300 --> 01:03:43,000 doing a private cover-up almost because 1657 01:03:47,130 --> 01:03:45,310 he has bought the records of MUFON and 1658 01:03:49,230 --> 01:03:47,140 he's also bought metamaterials with 1659 01:03:51,030 --> 01:03:49,240 taxpayer money and now those are being 1660 01:03:52,680 --> 01:03:51,040 analyzed by not an independent 1661 01:03:54,390 --> 01:03:52,690 laboratory but as I said earth Tech 1662 01:03:56,880 --> 01:03:54,400 International which is how put offs 1663 01:03:59,640 --> 01:03:56,890 company as part of TTS a so I think that 1664 01:04:01,710 --> 01:03:59,650 there's a need for more transparency 1665 01:04:04,710 --> 01:04:01,720 both in the government and in companies 1666 01:04:06,089 --> 01:04:04,720 like T TSA but T TSA as you said what's 1667 01:04:07,620 --> 01:04:06,099 coming down the line they said they're 1668 01:04:09,030 --> 01:04:07,630 gonna make a big announcement soon so 1669 01:04:11,670 --> 01:04:09,040 fingers crossed that that's actually 1670 01:04:13,829 --> 01:04:11,680 important and it's real analysis of 1671 01:04:16,680 --> 01:04:13,839 metamaterials I think they said it'll be 1672 01:04:18,960 --> 01:04:16,690 this week which is just finished so yeah 1673 01:04:22,440 --> 01:04:18,970 who's gonna be last week where is it 1674 01:04:26,210 --> 01:04:22,450 yeah so I will say yeah the the Bigelow 1675 01:04:29,390 --> 01:04:26,220 UFO reporting I have a friend who 1676 01:04:31,370 --> 01:04:29,400 is an air traffic controller and he says 1677 01:04:33,200 --> 01:04:31,380 they're pretty happy about that because 1678 01:04:35,599 --> 01:04:33,210 now they don't have to deal with with 1679 01:04:37,820 --> 01:04:35,609 UFO reports from people because they 1680 01:04:40,040 --> 01:04:37,830 would get not on toilets so much they 1681 01:04:41,810 --> 01:04:40,050 don't mind that they would get people 1682 01:04:43,250 --> 01:04:41,820 calling in the general public you know 1683 01:04:44,599 --> 01:04:43,260 saying I saw a light in the sky what is 1684 01:04:46,730 --> 01:04:44,609 that and then say well just call this 1685 01:04:50,570 --> 01:04:46,740 number now so they Bigelow has to deal 1686 01:04:52,970 --> 01:04:50,580 with it all all right so any you know 1687 01:04:54,980 --> 01:04:52,980 kind of gone over our hour here any kind 1688 01:04:56,750 --> 01:04:54,990 of final thoughts about what you 1689 01:04:59,839 --> 01:04:56,760 personally going to do with your 1690 01:05:02,089 --> 01:04:59,849 interest in UFOs well I'm just trying to 1691 01:05:04,880 --> 01:05:02,099 legitimize UFOs coming on your channel 1692 01:05:06,470 --> 01:05:04,890 trying to take it seriously prove that 1693 01:05:08,930 --> 01:05:06,480 there is a cover-up and also on my 1694 01:05:11,240 --> 01:05:08,940 youtube channel in theory QED I'm trying 1695 01:05:14,390 --> 01:05:11,250 to analyze UFOs in a critical thinking 1696 01:05:16,130 --> 01:05:14,400 sort of way to not debunk everything not 1697 01:05:18,320 --> 01:05:16,140 believe everything but try to look at 1698 01:05:19,940 --> 01:05:18,330 the data and see what is debunk able and 1699 01:05:22,400 --> 01:05:19,950 what is anomalous that we should pay 1700 01:05:25,370 --> 01:05:22,410 attention to but I have a few questions 1701 01:05:27,349 --> 01:05:25,380 for you if you don't mind so do you 1702 01:05:29,960 --> 01:05:27,359 think it's possible that et could visit 1703 01:05:31,550 --> 01:05:29,970 earth or are you just completely 1704 01:05:32,690 --> 01:05:31,560 discounting that as a possibility 1705 01:05:34,460 --> 01:05:32,700 because of the time and distance 1706 01:05:37,099 --> 01:05:34,470 involved well no I certainly think it's 1707 01:05:39,380 --> 01:05:37,109 possible but I think it would be just an 1708 01:05:41,300 --> 01:05:39,390 incredible coincidence that it would 1709 01:05:42,620 --> 01:05:41,310 happen at this time just because we know 1710 01:05:46,480 --> 01:05:42,630 for one thing we can't see any evidence 1711 01:05:49,390 --> 01:05:46,490 of alien life nearby in the universe and 1712 01:05:51,829 --> 01:05:49,400 it doesn't seem incredibly likely that's 1713 01:05:54,640 --> 01:05:51,839 civilizations would last a very very 1714 01:05:56,359 --> 01:05:54,650 long time you know we've been in this 1715 01:05:58,460 --> 01:05:56,369 civilization on earth has only been 1716 01:06:00,290 --> 01:05:58,470 around 10,000 years and technological 1717 01:06:03,740 --> 01:06:00,300 civilization has only been around 1718 01:06:06,230 --> 01:06:03,750 basically like a hundred years so the 1719 01:06:07,760 --> 01:06:06,240 idea that some alien civilization will 1720 01:06:10,880 --> 01:06:07,770 be in sync with us and just come to 1721 01:06:12,620 --> 01:06:10,890 visit us yes sure it's possible is it is 1722 01:06:15,050 --> 01:06:12,630 it a probable thing based on what we 1723 01:06:17,060 --> 01:06:15,060 know about the universe and the little 1724 01:06:20,390 --> 01:06:17,070 we know about how civilizations develop 1725 01:06:24,170 --> 01:06:20,400 I think that if there was alien life 1726 01:06:26,660 --> 01:06:24,180 nearby in the galaxy in the nearby stars 1727 01:06:29,150 --> 01:06:26,670 we would we would see evidence of it in 1728 01:06:32,660 --> 01:06:29,160 space and it wouldn't just be nothing in 1729 01:06:34,520 --> 01:06:32,670 space and some some aliens on earth but 1730 01:06:35,750 --> 01:06:34,530 if our detection capabilities increased 1731 01:06:38,450 --> 01:06:35,760 both with satellites and other 1732 01:06:39,870 --> 01:06:38,460 technologies and we did find life we 1733 01:06:42,690 --> 01:06:39,880 would certainly send a probe 1734 01:06:44,279 --> 01:06:42,700 right so I think it's it makes sense to 1735 01:06:47,420 --> 01:06:44,289 assume that aliens would do the same I 1736 01:06:50,430 --> 01:06:47,430 don't think we would send a probe the 1737 01:06:55,079 --> 01:06:50,440 not for a few years 1738 01:06:56,490 --> 01:06:55,089 okay you at firsts the problem we start 1739 01:06:57,720 --> 01:06:56,500 sending a probe it depends how far away 1740 01:06:59,910 --> 01:06:57,730 it is you know this is the big problem 1741 01:07:01,440 --> 01:06:59,920 with space travel is that it takes 1742 01:07:03,839 --> 01:07:01,450 hundreds of years to get anywhere unless 1743 01:07:05,460 --> 01:07:03,849 it just happens to be on the star even 1744 01:07:07,920 --> 01:07:05,470 if it was on one of the nearby stars I 1745 01:07:08,970 --> 01:07:07,930 give it as on the start the closest 1746 01:07:11,759 --> 01:07:08,980 start for like two or three light-years 1747 01:07:13,799 --> 01:07:11,769 away you could send a radio signal there 1748 01:07:15,509 --> 01:07:13,809 and get a response back so you first of 1749 01:07:19,470 --> 01:07:15,519 all you tried to do that but you know 1750 01:07:21,180 --> 01:07:19,480 most of the stars you know thousands of 1751 01:07:22,380 --> 01:07:21,190 stars within a hundred light-years but 1752 01:07:26,720 --> 01:07:22,390 that's going to take a thousand years 1753 01:07:31,249 --> 01:07:26,730 for a probe to get there yeah it's it's 1754 01:07:33,809 --> 01:07:31,259 yeah maybe we would but we would we send 1755 01:07:36,990 --> 01:07:33,819 crafted capable of flying around and 1756 01:07:38,400 --> 01:07:37,000 shadowing the the limits fleet or 1757 01:07:41,220 --> 01:07:38,410 something like that no we probably sent 1758 01:07:43,289 --> 01:07:41,230 something that was more like a static 1759 01:07:45,059 --> 01:07:43,299 craft that would do a little 1760 01:07:47,279 --> 01:07:45,069 gravitational slingshot around the star 1761 01:07:49,319 --> 01:07:47,289 or something like that just it just 1762 01:07:52,490 --> 01:07:49,329 doesn't seem you know obviously we'd 1763 01:07:54,420 --> 01:07:52,500 want to go there sounds great mm-hmm 1764 01:07:56,700 --> 01:07:54,430 what's the odds of it actually happening 1765 01:07:59,249 --> 01:07:56,710 in terms of yeah synchronizing 1766 01:08:00,779 --> 01:07:59,259 technological development I think the 1767 01:08:02,160 --> 01:08:00,789 greatest likelihood of getting around 1768 01:08:03,809 --> 01:08:02,170 that great filter that you're talking 1769 01:08:06,660 --> 01:08:03,819 about with the synchronization of 1770 01:08:08,849 --> 01:08:06,670 civilizations is if we become either 1771 01:08:12,299 --> 01:08:08,859 through transhumanism or just through 1772 01:08:15,299 --> 01:08:12,309 the creation of an AI or an AGI super 1773 01:08:17,879 --> 01:08:15,309 intelligence of machine learning machine 1774 01:08:19,919 --> 01:08:17,889 intelligence if that intelligence can 1775 01:08:22,140 --> 01:08:19,929 make self-replicating probes it could 1776 01:08:24,720 --> 01:08:22,150 search the galaxy relatively quickly and 1777 01:08:26,999 --> 01:08:24,730 then also have insane technologies that 1778 01:08:28,200 --> 01:08:27,009 we can't even dream of yet yeah I would 1779 01:08:30,720 --> 01:08:28,210 agree with that and that's something I 1780 01:08:33,360 --> 01:08:30,730 brought up with with Seth but he can 1781 01:08:34,800 --> 01:08:33,370 appeared it a bit but I think I think 1782 01:08:37,470 --> 01:08:34,810 it's a pretty solid idea of it there 1783 01:08:39,599 --> 01:08:37,480 would be the robots going throughout the 1784 01:08:41,220 --> 01:08:39,609 galaxy and the future unfortunately 1785 01:08:44,459 --> 01:08:41,230 probably with robots rather than with 1786 01:08:46,320 --> 01:08:44,469 with humans so so that's my last 1787 01:08:48,990 --> 01:08:46,330 question at the time is why do you think 1788 01:08:51,090 --> 01:08:49,000 these these academic sorry I'm going 1789 01:08:53,459 --> 01:08:51,100 over but why do you think Neil deGrasse 1790 01:08:55,799 --> 01:08:53,469 Tyson and 1791 01:08:57,239 --> 01:08:55,809 saw stack and also Bill Nye the Science 1792 01:08:59,579 --> 01:08:57,249 Guy why do you think they're so 1793 01:09:01,499 --> 01:08:59,589 adamantly opposed to the idea of 1794 01:09:04,819 --> 01:09:01,509 extraterrestrial visitation they don't 1795 01:09:07,200 --> 01:09:04,829 even entertain the idea whatsoever I 1796 01:09:08,549 --> 01:09:07,210 don't think that adamantly opposed to it 1797 01:09:11,939 --> 01:09:08,559 but they adamantly feel that the 1798 01:09:14,279 --> 01:09:11,949 evidence is pointing against it in terms 1799 01:09:16,979 --> 01:09:14,289 of not being able to detect alien life 1800 01:09:19,279 --> 01:09:16,989 and you know I think perhaps perhaps 1801 01:09:23,969 --> 01:09:19,289 they're a little bit stuck in their ways 1802 01:09:26,910 --> 01:09:23,979 but they probably know a lot more about 1803 01:09:29,759 --> 01:09:26,920 astrophysics than we do so maybe their 1804 01:09:32,009 --> 01:09:29,769 perspective on astrophysics actually 1805 01:09:34,109 --> 01:09:32,019 gives them insight into the likelihood 1806 01:09:35,879 --> 01:09:34,119 of things like they understand how far 1807 01:09:38,189 --> 01:09:35,889 away these stars are and they understand 1808 01:09:41,549 --> 01:09:38,199 how many of the nearby stars might have 1809 01:09:43,859 --> 01:09:41,559 habitable planets and they've no doubt 1810 01:09:46,499 --> 01:09:43,869 given some thought to the developments 1811 01:09:49,349 --> 01:09:46,509 of civilizations and what the actual 1812 01:09:51,989 --> 01:09:49,359 numbers are in terms of you know will 1813 01:09:54,959 --> 01:09:51,999 there be something nearby so yeah maybe 1814 01:09:59,910 --> 01:09:54,969 like you know TV scientists they're not 1815 01:10:02,759 --> 01:09:59,920 over I don't think mishio Kaku is really 1816 01:10:05,149 --> 01:10:02,769 have a good point at all and yeah Neil 1817 01:10:09,029 --> 01:10:05,159 deGrasse Tyson often say stupid things 1818 01:10:12,390 --> 01:10:09,039 and I'm still Bill Nye and whoever the 1819 01:10:16,169 --> 01:10:12,400 other guy was chef maybe they also get 1820 01:10:17,879 --> 01:10:16,179 things wrong from time to time but if if 1821 01:10:20,879 --> 01:10:17,889 all things are being equal I kind of 1822 01:10:24,419 --> 01:10:20,889 would defer to a an astrophysicist over 1823 01:10:26,069 --> 01:10:24,429 my own personal opinion well thanks for 1824 01:10:27,450 --> 01:10:26,079 having me on it was really fun and I 1825 01:10:29,129 --> 01:10:27,460 think we found some middle ground here 1826 01:10:30,509 --> 01:10:29,139 so that was great yeah no it's great 1827 01:10:31,979 --> 01:10:30,519 thank you for being on and it's always 1828 01:10:36,830 --> 01:10:31,989 great to talk to someone about these 1829 01:10:40,709 --> 01:10:38,879 they'll be interesting he's got a kind 1830 01:10:42,469 --> 01:10:40,719 of a different personality to you I 1831 01:10:43,950 --> 01:10:42,479 think and it will be interesting to see 1832 01:10:46,109 --> 01:10:43,960 what he does 1833 01:10:48,149 --> 01:10:46,119 I might even talk to Nick Pope as well 1834 01:10:50,520 --> 01:10:48,159 I'm going I'm doing like UFO month I 1835 01:10:52,229 --> 01:10:50,530 think this month then I might have to go 1836 01:10:53,689 --> 01:10:52,239 back to something great more 1837 01:10:58,920 --> 01:10:53,699 entertaining like Flat Earth after that 1838 01:11:02,850 --> 01:10:58,930 we shall see all right well thanks a lot